Texas Church Shooting is Textbook Argument Against Gun Control











It would be nice to live in a world where we didn’t immediately have to start talking politics after some lunatic shoots up a concert, a movie theater, or, God help us, a small church in rural Texas. Then again, it might be nice to live in a world where these things don’t happen at all.

Unfortunately, we live in neither world. We live in the world where these atrocities do happen and where liberal Democrats jump to push their anti-gun agenda when they do. They do this when the killer purchases his guns legally, in such a way that no additional regulations would have made a difference. They do this when the killer stole his gun from someone else, in such a way that no additional regulations would have made a difference. And they do it in cases like these, where – by all early accounts – the killer was someone who, under current state and federal law, was not allowed to possess a gun in the first place.

According to the Daily Beast, the shooter in Sutherland Springs used an assault rifle – either an AR-15 or a knockoff – to kill at least 26 people and wound 20 others at this small church in Texas. But the shooter, Devin Patrick Kelly, was court-martialed and discharged from the Air Force in 2014 as a result of a domestic violence conviction. He was charged with assaulting his wife and child, and his bad conduct discharge from the military, in conjunction with this domestic violence conviction, should have precluded him from owning the weapon used in the mass murder.

As of Monday, it was not clear if Kelly managed to find some loophole in this law, whether the background system failed, or whether he simply procured his gun through some not-quite-legal means. We’ll see. Regardless, it shows you that the typical Democrat answer to these shootings – stricter, more comprehensive gun laws – is no answer at all.

But it certainly hasn’t kept them from doing their usual thing.

Former President Barack Obama kicked things off with a thinly-disguised call for gun control on Twitter: “We grieve with all the families in Sutherland Springs harmed by this act of hatred, and we’ll stand with the survivors as they recover. May God also grant all of us the wisdom to ask what concrete steps we can take to reduce the violence and weaponry in our midst.”

Sen. Dick Durbin said: “The shooter turned his gun on people – kids – in a place of worship. America is in the grips of a gun violence crisis. Congress must act.”

Sen. Richard Blumenthal said: “Enough is enough. Now is the time for commonsense gun violence prevention steps. Congressional complicity must end.”

Democrats like California Lt. Gov. Gavin Newsome managed to mix prayer shaming with gun grabbing in a nice little package: “They were in their church praying when this happened,” he wrote in response to Paul Ryan’s call for thoughts and prayers. “What they need is gun control.”

Hmm, we wonder what the congregation in this small, rural Texas community thinks about that…

Plenty of liberal celebrities also jumped on the bandwagon so they could demonstrate to the social media world how thoughtful, caring, and wise they were.

Stephen King: “How many more have to die before we enact sane gun control laws?”

Chelsea Handler: “Innocent people go to church on Sunday to honor their God, and while doing so, get shot and killed. What country? America. Why? Republicans.”

Sarah Silverman: “When a plane crashes, air travel becomes exponentially safer bc of the lessons learned. But 1 mass shooting after another…nothing.”

Of course, what none of these celebrities or Democrats are willing to acknowledge is that, according to our best gauge of the situation, the killer was actually stopped by two residents who were packing heat at the time of the shooting. If one of them – a churchgoer with a gun of his own – had not shot the perpetrator, there’s no telling what kind of horrific story we would be talking about today. God knows the story is horrific enough as it is.


  • Buckeye conservative

    As always the liberal dems start flapping their mouths within minutes of any terrible shooting. Trump, again, gives a reasonable comment that the problem is mental health, not guns per se. And again, making sure to get his big mouth in gear Obama comes out with his platitudes and often tearful plea for his favorite “common sense gun control”. Sickening and somewhat silly when you hear about how the situation was actually handled by a gun welding neighbor and friend.

  • Retired

    The Same idiots that scream for gun control refuse to do anything about mental health care and better insurance coverage for it . Years back it was the Democrats that insisted on putting mental patients on the streets and many were Vets. that needed health care .

    • FloridaBoyee

      REMEMBER LAST WEEK? AN AMERICAN HATER RENTED a Truck from U-Haul and ran over ALL of these bikers on a BIKE PATH!! DID ANYONE run around and say they need to make it a LAW NOT to RENT a TRUCK?? HELL, NO!! Had we NOT had two gun owners that chased this LUNATIC down, he would have killed some more innocent people!! HOW MANY of these IDIOTS in HOLLYWOOD, play the “heroes” with GUNS and shooting the bad guys on the Movie Screens and go away and are the HEROES of the movie? THEN, say THEY WANT GUN CONTROL? They have NO IDEA what it is to have a REAL BULLET whizzing by your head in real life or a land mine blowing your arms or legs off, do they! GET REAL, PEOPLE!!There are real SICK people out there and they have NO Sorrow for shooting you! It is REALISTIC!! Get off of these GUN CONTROL campaigns!! Get a REAL LIFE and QUIT making these movies as this is realistic!

      • Retired

        You hit on one of the biggest problems in the US , Hollywood . Remember Rosie and her big mouth about guns until it was made public she has gun toting security guards .

        • sanpete

          rosie needs gun caring security. what a wast of hummen flesh

          • ARJAY

            Human???? flesh.

        • INVENTOR INVENTED

          They have legal permits.

          • Retired

            What does that have to do with Rosie running off at the mouth and her opposition to guns ????

          • Rodney Steward

            LOLOL, now that’s a FULL BLOWN IDIOT RT !!! HA, HA, HA…………

          • Retired

            Have you noticed how many of these clowns are suddenly appearing ???? AK must have a lot of relatives .

          • Rodney Steward

            It’s a Dem. thingy, if it had been a muslim that committed this mass murder, not one word would have ever been mentioned about gun control!! AK does get around !! LOL, that crazy witch !!!

          • Scuttlebutt

            I would like to know “WHY” muslims are still allowed to enter our Country? Have they NOT proved to us, how dangerous they are?

          • Rodney Steward

            To many of the Obama judges left to continue blocking everything possible move that Trump makes! It’s just a matter of time before they pull a major Jihad on this country, they’re here building and waiting!

          • Retired

            Tell that to the Democrats – Obama – Clinton and the UN that pushes these people on the US and EU .

          • ernldo

            Because you have hussein appointed liberal judge traitors that block every Trump order to STOP the free flow of muzlim filth into OUR nation, and a congress full of demotards and rinos that are content with our population pollution…That’s why!

          • ipsd48

            Unless they can use it. Notice where libs attacked after the terrorist used a truck in NY……………………MORE GUN CONTROL

          • Rodney Steward

            They use any and everything for gun control, these are the real Anti-American!!

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          • rockyndallas

            As do many of us. That is not the issue. The hypocrisy is the issue. And disarming people who want the ability to protect themselves and their families accomplishes what exactly? Criminals don’t care about laws.

          • Rodney Steward

            Chicago is proof of that, strictest gun laws in America and the highest crime rate!!

          • Scuttlebutt

            Please allow the killing to continue in Chicago. It assists in getting America clear of criminals.

          • Rodney Steward

            I totally agree, that would be called “Thug Control” !!!! 🙂

          • Retired

            No room at the Hotels so they let them kill each other , but they have room for the Drunk Drivers which are not much better .

          • Retired

            Drug and Gun distribution center in the Upper Midwest , from there it spreads in all directions .

          • Retired

            Last weekend 30 shootings and 8 dead , that did not include all the ones during the week .

          • Rodney Steward

            HMMM, down a little, that’s not good!! 🙂 But you never here anything about this crap from the gun patrol!

          • Retired

            They do NOT wish to talk about it because most guns are stolen as well as the AMO .

          • Rodney Steward

            Exactly, and plus this is one of the places Obama calls home!!

          • Retired

            You got it he went home to Chitcago to serve on a Jury and visit Rahm at the bath house where he met Michael .

          • Rodney Steward

            And no doubt, sit in a circle and hummed, or play drop the soap!

          • Retired

            They don’t need to drop the soap at the bath house , it come natural there .

          • Rodney Steward

            I figured they liked the bubbles!

          • INVENTOR INVENTED

            New York City and state have very strict gun laws and New York City is the safest big city with the lowest gun crime rate.

          • Rodney Steward

            Sorry, but it has gone up by 20% due to the MS-13 gangs that Trump has declared war on, Dip and Homo aren’t going to do anything! Even 60 minutes had a special on the MS-13 gangs of NY!!

          • INVENTOR INVENTED

            Strictly enforcing the laws WILL take guns out of the hands of most criminals.
            If automatic weapons and bump stocks are outlawed there will be a decrease in crazy mass murders like the Las Vegas Concert and that church shooting. The nutcase that slipped through the military’s notification system wouldn’t have had guns to kill people if the system worked as designed. No shooting would have occurred instead of the shoot-out at that church that left 23 dead.

          • Norman

            FYI, automatic firearms have been outlawed in the USA since 1934 except to a law-abiding citizens who:

            a) Pay a $200 annual “tax”;

            b) Fill out a lengthy detailed application form;
            c) Submit photographs and fingerprints;
            d) Register their automatic firearm(s) with the BATFE;
            e) Convince their chief local law enforcement official to sign their application; and

            f) Pass an extensive annual background check.

            YOUR leftist ACLU filed a lawsuit a little over a year ago because it claimed denying firearms to nutcases was discriminating against nutcases. That’s right; the very same leftist ACLU that is opposed to sane, law-abiding citizens owning firearms believes criminal nutcases should have firearms.

          • rockyndallas

            It’s because the left wants these. Incidents. They don’t give a damn about victoms and collateral damage. It is all about their agenda to disarm lawful Americans. And Mr. invented is full of crap.

          • ipsd48

            And the same thing for suppressers………….which makes absolutely no sense

          • Rodney Steward

            Automatics have been outlawed since the 1920’s, and bump stocks are an after market part and not against the law and are very easily made!! Las Vegas was a deep state set up, that man did NOT do this, he was dead before it started ! Now they can’t get his so called girlfriend by again for more questioning, and now 3 different videos have shown 3 different shooters!

          • ipsd48

            You realize they would have to ban belt loops too…………..as they can be used to get the same effect of a bump stock

        • Scuttlebutt

          Yep—and just look how popular she is NOW:):):) What a looser:)

          • Retired

            Even her Daughter does not want anything to do with her . Now she is out chasing a younger Dyke .

      • BeachN

        No that one was created to make us fear that ISIS is here to kill us all lol. They each have their purpose. There is an active agenda and snippets here and there from each of them have proven that. They are all beginning to have the same mirrored patterns. Not at all like anything that is random . Tell me why are some of the same witnesses at a lot of these events??There is much more out there to enlighten everyone but most are not as curious as some of us.. Now bring in the trolls to condemn my thoughts. Condemn all you want as it will not stop this person from always seeking the truth. We will be lead to our own demise if we do not seek the truth.

      • Jim Tuggle

        A number of these ‘so called smart people who are bitching that we need more gun control’ travel with armed security persons. They have no real idea of what it is like to have to face even an unarmed attacker themselves….they are taught to cover up as best they can for the 10 or 15 seconds it takes one or more of their guards to intervene.

      • Mike

        we have regulated cars and made then safer over the years. we responded to tragedies involving car accidents and worked to make automobiles safer.

        • Tired…

          The role of firearms as outlined in the second ammendment is very clear; there is no such ammendment related to automobiles. In addition, manufacturers continually work to make firearms safer.

          The reality is that a culture of hate has been deliberately fostered in this country and this shooter only one one in a long line of hate-filled murderers fueled by selfishness. Let’s start with having honest conversations about the hate behind the violence instead of focusing on one issue alone. The concept of ‘gun violence’ is idiotic because it suggests, through omission, that other forms of violence are acceptable. Can’t we agree that all violence is wrong and work to resolve differeces in a healthy manner? Sadly, I think that the answer is ‘no.’

          • C. LeSaint

            PUT GOD BACK IN AMERICA!!!

        • Gary Smith

          Your point?

          • Mike

            My point is that the individuals argument that we did not call for more regulation into rentals, trucks etc following the terrorist attack is ridiculous because we do regulate cars, rentals etc and as a country we have seen a dramatic decrease in the number of deaths in automobiles over the past several decades. We mandated as a society that cars be made safer and we succeeded. We can do the same for firearms. There is no reason why we are so paralyzed about firearms. We could ban assaults style weapons such as the AR 15 and have more stringent background checks etc. Would this solve every problem possible no it would not, but it may help. The country of Australia did eliminate certain weapons in a buy back program following a mass shooting and since that time with some stricter gun control measures they have not had a mass shooting. They also had a decrease in the suicide rate and in gun related homicides. We as a society should not just accept these mass shootings as routine and should work to find the middle ground together for increased safety and respecting the rights of the many to own weapons responsibly.

          • tCotUS

            A Rental truck killed a lot of Federal employee’s in Kansas City.

          • mac12sam12

            Banning the AR won’t stop people who shouldn’t own a gun from getting one like the Texas shooter. Want my AR platform rifles? When the citizens of CT> and NY were told to register their AR platform rifles no one complied. Registration means confiscation. The state police said they would not be going door to door. I will never comply.

          • Mike

            That is the problem. You claim that laws could not work because legal gun owners would follow the law and criminals would not, but then you turn around and say you would never comply if a law was made that banned the AR 15 or something similar. This is how we get to this complete paralysis on guns and we just accept gun violence as a matter of course. The right is unwilling to move at all in a direction that could make the public safer and admittedly the left many times wants to move too quickly.

          • mac12sam12

            You can’t all of a sudden make something that has always been legal, illegal. The criminals are the ones who have illegal weapons. AR platform rifles are not the problem, it’s liberals with firearms, that’s the problem.

          • Rodney Steward

            So true, they make kits to make any weapon have the AR look, from shoot guns to 22 rifles!!!!!!

          • mac12sam12

            The handle thingy terrifies liberals.

          • Rodney Steward

            Absolutely !!

          • Mike

            We have made items in this country illegal that were legal before several times in this country so I do not understand why that could not work again. As has been pointed out many times in the past many of the worst mass shootings were carried out by individuals who had purchased their firearms legally. The idea of banning a weapon which is used in many mass shootings would eliminate that potential threat to others. I am sure there are other solutions and I am not saying this is the only solution, but there needs to be a willingness to discuss gun control measures on both sides to come to an appropriate conclusion.

          • Rodney Steward

            Give me an example of the legal and illegal thing, other than full auto that’s so easy to make!

          • Mike

            I am not sure if you are only referring to guns, but we have made everything from certain types of weapons as you noted illegal to everything from interracial marriage, selling alcohol on Sundays, certain narcotics, segregation etc that were all legal and were made illegal. We have done that sort of thing many times and generally, although not always, improved.

          • Rodney Steward

            WOW these are fine assault weapons!

          • ipsd48

            None of those things were EVER mentioned in the constitution, so they would fall under civil/common law as opposed to constitutional law

          • Mike

            in looking at the secondi amendment it says nothing about assault weapons, AR 15, etc. actually it does not mention any particular weapons at all so then based on your logic all types of guns not specifically mentioned in the second amendment would also fall under that.

          • mac12sam12

            It’s not going to happen because gun owners won’t compel and that’s already been proven. Almost all gun crime is in democrat controlled slums with the toughest gun laws in the nation and those crimes are gang related. S. Side of Chicago last year there was 716 people killed and 4,379 shot and wounded. I guess their tough gun laws don’t work. You can’t see the forrest for the trees.

          • Mike

            So you are stating that if a ban was put in place all of the legal gun owners, like you, would immediately become illegal gun owners by refusing to comply? That seems odd considering one of the main planks of gun owners is that they comply with the laws of this country, but you are suggesting they would not and would actively break the law and become criminals.

          • Rodney Steward

            Chicago has THE STRICTEST GUN LAWS in the country, but have the HIGHEST CRIME!! Do you see the picture yet, bad guys DO NOT follow the rules and LAWS!

          • Mike

            No one is suggesting that you can eliminate all crime or that every individual will be responsible, but doing nothing is working very poorly as we continue to have frequent mass shootings. It is strange that the right would advocate paralysis and insist on doing nothing rather than taking steps that may save the lives of Americans.

          • JMICHAEL270

            You can’t argue with an idiot or crazy person Rodney, this guy is in the ozone.

          • Rodney Steward

            A Maxine Waters for sure!

          • Rodney Steward

            Grow a pair and join the military, you’ll have a whole different outlook, I promise!!

          • mac12sam12

            When Clinton passed a law that said no more AR platform rifles it has no effect on anything.

            You lib loons have no clue, making laws tougher for law abiding citizens never saves lives. Tougher laws on those who commit the gun crimes. They’re always people who have an illegal firearm. Longer setences for those people.

          • Norman

            That would be a case of the law violating legal gun owner rights NOT a case of legal gun owners violating the law. Please refer to the Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, Mike.

          • ipsd48

            To quite Chief Justice John Marshall; ” Any law repugnant to the Constitution is no law at all”

          • Norman

            Which of those banned items were mentioned in the Bill of Rights?

          • Mike

            we have and the supreme court has held certain weapons can be regulated which is why individuals cannot own bazookas, tanks etc. we also have banned certain types of speech such as you cannot yell fire in a crowded theater. freedom of speech is a central tenet of the bill of rights as is the second amendment.

          • ipsd48

            That’s not entirely true. I know a bar in WI that has both a Huey Cobra and a Sheridan tank on display

          • Lisa Meyer

            So, say all the guns are banned, and everyone turns in all the guns they own. Do you think that will stop all of the mentally challenged idiots from committing mass murders? No. They will just use another “tool”. Just like the Terrorist in NYC did. And the terrorists in France. And Spain. What gets banned next? And where does the line get drawn?
            The bottom line is, if the laws already on the books were enforced, many of these horrific crimes would never happen. And, in the case of the church shooting in TX., if it had not been for two citizens with guns, who knows how many more people the shooter would have killed.

          • Rodney Steward

            The so called assault weapon AR-15 is a joke, any thing can be an assault weapon, a flip, or slingshot can be an assault weapon, even a ball bat, this is just a gun ban push!! It’s never going to stop, it’ll be one thing after another just like the game the blacks are playing, it started out with BLM, then kill cops, then remove all statues, now it’s the anthem, the Flag and Constitution because it’s a White man thing, it’s never going to stop till we’re all considered Domestic Terrorist!

          • JMICHAEL270

            Mike everyone should be allowed to carry if they are proficient with their weapon, and if you idiots will realize gun free zones are just an open invitation for sick individuals to kill and inflict maximum carnage we will be headed in the right direction.

          • will

            No Armalite Rifle 15 try some say. Designed by Stoner at Armilte Corp they had to award a licence to Colt and eventually others so it could be produced in numbers to supply armed forces. Basically 4 generatios A1 -A4

          • ipsd48

            Tho the Matel company got the first contract………………..and it became known as the “Mighty Matel’ in vietnam

          • ipsd48

            Why should I give up MY right to defend myself and family because OTHER people have phobia about guns?

          • Mike

            that is the nonsense from the right. banning a particular weapon does not eliminate your ability to protect your family. in fact an AR 15 does not appear to be a very practical home protection weapon.

          • ipsd48

            that doesn’t answer why I should be responsible for other people’s phobias

          • Mike

            it is not a phobia when there are mass shootings this frequently.

          • Eddie

            The term AR-15! Stands for assault rifle (style) hunting weapon. It does not mean the gun is a military issue rifle full out. Yes it looks good to most military type men, but it is still the .223 rifle you hunt with either made like the AR or wooden stock hunting rifle. I learn to shoot guns and respect them since I was 6 yr old. And today not one gun I’ve owned jumped up and shot at me or my family?

          • Rodney Steward

            Great comment Eddie, spending 12 years in the Army I love the AR platform and weight, like you I’ve never had a weapon to jump up and go crazy!!

          • will

            .223 or 5.56x 45 there are three different chambers
            .223
            Wylde a hybrid
            Nato Chamber
            basically the difference is in the lead or freebore

          • Eddie

            We are not talking about chamber or lead here. We are talking about the ignorant liberal gun haters that think this rifle is a full out military assault rifle. WHICH IT IS NOT. Educate don’t instigate.

          • ipsd48

            Wrong; ‘AR’ stands for ‘Armalite’, the original patent holder of that weapon

          • Eddie

            Armalite is a manufacture like Ford, Chev. This is what people talk about is the style is made by many. It’s like SUV YOU KNOW?

          • Eddie

            You just don’t get it. Your lips are moving and you are not listening just like the young generation. No commen sence? Reread and you might get it?

          • Rodney Steward

            Amazing that our mass killings are from people that are Dems. and terrorist, and only idiots use the Australian LIE! Their crime rate is through the roof, rapes off the chart by muslims and their crime rate went up 40% and like the guy that just become an American citizen from Australia on FOX NEWS, you fight to keep your guns! You start with one thing it leads to another and another!

          • Mike

            First of your statistics are just plain wrong on Australia. From the National Australian Homicide Monitoring program report 2012: “The homicide rate has continued to decline each year, since 1989-90. The periods 2010–2011 and 2011–2012 are the lowest homicide rate since data collection began in 1989”. There has not been some crime spree in Australia since they banned and did their gun buy back. The majority of mass killings are not Democrat, nor are they really Republican as there is no known correlation between political party and mass shootings.

          • Rodney Steward

            So I can go to the name you gave above and pull this up, you’re wrong but this is to be the fact, correct!

          • Mike

            Absolutely. In fact here is the link for 2010 through 2012 which shows continued decrease in the homicide rate in Australia. http://aic.gov.au/publications/current%20series/mr/21-40/mr23/04_homicide-2010-12.html

          • Rodney Steward

            You’re right, murders are down by GUNS, they don’t have guns now! The number one killer now is the KNIFE, and did you see where most of the killing are, HOME INVASIONS, people can no longer protect themselves, but now this is different! This was 2012 before the muslim invasion that’s not even mentioned in this report! It’s now 5 years later!

          • ipsd48

            He said nothing about the homicide rate. It was the CRIME rate that went up. Vicious crimes like assault , rape, etc.

          • Scuttlebutt

            I do not agree—-just yesterday, an Aussy was on a news station & admitted that gun control has failed in his Country.

          • Mike

            i assume you are talking about Nick Adams. an Australian native who has not lived in thr country in a decade and has been discredited by social scientists in his own country but fox news trotts him out every time they want to talk negatively about the successful gun reforms in Australia.

          • ipsd48

            Those ‘social scientists’ spend their time in Air conditioned offices in t he big cities. They don’t go to the outback…………..where people never gave up their guns

          • Mike

            they absolutely did have the guns bought back. the laws did not outlaw all guns, but did ban certain weapons and yes the whole country did comply.

        • tCotUS

          Hummmmm Mike…I laid a 357 on my kitchen counter for two days…The darn thing never moved an inch. I even hide around the corner where it couldn’t see or hear me, Same result, it didn’t move. I wonder if I own one that’s deaf & dumb like a liberal ?

          • Mike

            by that logic we should not regulate anything. i mean a car does not move on its own so forget safety standards. airplanes don’t crash on their own so why regulate airplanes. oh wait we regulate items for public safety concerns. we are having a mass shooting in this country approximately every four days which does make this a public safety concern.

          • mac12sam12

            The gun laws don’t work because they’re directed at the people who aren’t committing the crimes. Common sense tells you that have tougher sentences for people that are former felons who have illegal weapons. Liberals are so fricken stupid.

          • Mike

            Your idea about tougher sentences for repeat gun offenders could certainly be a part of a plan for gun control. Again there is no reason to not examine all possibilities when we are faced with this incredible number of mass shootings and overall gun violence.

          • mac12sam12

            For first time offenders, if you’re caught with an illegal weapon it’s automatic prison time.

          • Mike

            again I am not saying that tougher and better enforcement is a bad idea but we can go further than that and do more to prevent gun violence.

          • mac12sam12

            Bloomberg stop and frisk worked, and it is constitutional. Two gang members standing on a corner exchanging money and small packages is reasonable suspicion. No one carried with Bloomberg in office.

          • Mike

            it was ruled unconstitutional in how the police were implementing it. but yes they could have continued the program had they followed the guidelines from the judge. I am not opposed to any idea but I do believe a ban on assault style weapons is appropriate.

          • mac12sam12

            It is constitutional and is used every day, just not enough.

            No ban on AR platform rifles. Did you know that I’ve shot 20 round mags out of firearms that look nothing like ARs? Won’t make a difference.

          • Mike

            the judge ruled it unconstitutional in how it was implemented as it was disproportionately being used against minorities, but importantly she ruled the program could still be used under certain conditions. as for banning certain types of guns and/or having magazine limits again I am open to most anything to help the scourge of gun violence in America.

          • ipsd48

            One thing that will NOT help…………is encouraging haplophobia

          • mac12sam12

            It was used against minorities because that’s who commits 90% of the gun crime.

          • ipsd48

            Every gun since muskets were ‘assault weapons’. So why don’t you define an ‘assault weapon’ for us?

          • chucky001

            Stupid post. The laws don’t work because they are not uniform across the nation. Tough laws in Chicago are no defence against someone bringing in a gun bought in Georgia which has almost no gun laws. BTW I see you have bred. A pity. I feel sorry for the kid having an ass-hat for a parent.

          • mac12sam12

            Doesn’t matter where they were brought from or stolen from they’re going to get them anyway, numb nuts.

          • Raymond Bell

            Chucky, you are so free in your determination of the value of name calling, like most out of touch Liberals, Why can’t you point your finger at the true object of the negativity that you seem to be so virtuously concerned with. Name calling is the nature of child and maybe you never grew up?

          • ipsd48

            …………..or bought in a back alley in chicago

          • Scuttlebutt

            OMG—that makes sense:) Why would politicians do anything that makes common sense?

          • mary murphy

            Have you already forgotten that guns are ALREADY regulated?

          • chucky001

            But they are not regulated uniformly, stupid. That’s the problem. Now get down on your knees and service your master.

          • FloridaBoyee

            Mike, do you work for the Government? Or are you a Socialist? We keep getting TOO many Government Regulations, OUR Government CONTROLS US!! NOT in my world, anyway!!

          • chucky001

            Thanks for using a pic with your posts. Now we can see what conservitard ass hats look like.

          • bendecido

            As [er the picture in your name, it looks like you are full of sh!t !

          • ipsd48

            How many of those shootings are a direct result of the govt NOT enforcing the laws ALREADY on the books?

          • will

            it fooled you it was sleeping – maybe its needs better lube. Look at Archoil – Mil-com 🙂

          • tCotUS

            Will do will

          • Eddie

            You better watch your car it kills more everyday than a shooting. So lube that .

          • Rodney Steward

            So does cellphones, they’re evil and have no feeling either!!

          • Eddie

            That was an intelligent answer??…

          • Rodney Steward

            Just cutting up with you guys, but cellphones have surpassed DUI’s deaths in my state, and now they want to make the fine the same as a DUI for texting and using while driving!

          • Scuttlebutt

            About time:)

          • Retired

            It is getting like that all over the country, even in states that banned the use .

          • Scuttlebutt

            Cell phone have finally been named, the largest cause of car wrecks in the USA. It’s about time.

          • Eddie

            My case exactly.

          • chucky001

            If you are stupid enough to leave a gun laying around where anyone could break in and use it against you, then I guess you are stupid enough to be a Trump troll.

        • C. LeSaint

          But when an evil one who wants to kill people, gets behind the WHEEL and uses said vehicle as a weapon, the democrats say nothing about vehicle control.

          • Mike

            we have regulated vehicles and in conjunction with republicans after 9-11 we regulated airlines and airport security more heavily, but we have a mass shootings approximately every four days in this country and the right would rather have that continue.

          • tCotUS

            . Depending on where you get your Data ..NYT says ” It is impossible to know whether the number of mass shootings has risen in recent years because the databases go back only a couple of years”. Guns are already regulated, like how did the last Nut case buy arms? Red Flag (1) He was in a mental institution 2 Domestic violence 3 Child abuse 4 Court Martialed We already have these red flags in place. Someone is not doing there job.
            But while we’re at it. Lets take a look at some real statistics..•In 2015, 10,265 people died in alcohol-impaired driving crashes, accounting for nearly one-third (29%) of all traffic-related deaths in the United States.1
            •Of the 1, 1,132 traffic deaths among children ages 0 to 14 years in 2015, 209 (16%) involved an alcohol-impaired driver.1
            •In 2015, nearly 1.1 million drivers were arrested for driving under the influence of alcohol or narcotics.3 That’s one percent of the 111 million self-reported episodes of alcohol-impaired driving among U.S. adults each year.
            OOOOHH what are the worthless Liberals saying about this? Nothing that’s what..

          • Mike

            That is actually not true at all. Liberals have absolutely been pushing for a DUI ignition interlock device to potentially be installed in every new car. this technology is available and yes liberals have absolutely wanted it at the very least for any individuals convicted of a drunk driving offense. Again liberals are not choosing to ignore the problem of drunk driving we are looking for potential solutions. This is the same for mass shootings. https://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/03/us/how-often-do-mass-shootings-occur-on-average-every-day-records-show.html

            https://www.livescience.com/51991-why-america-is-prone-to-mass-shootings.html

            In this country we have about 5 percent of the worlds population but have 31 percent of the world’s mass shootings. We can do better than that as a country. I am sorry that you do not feel we can, but I believe we absolutely can do better than that.

          • tCotUS

            “The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. -Adolph Hitler-
            “If the opposition disarms, well and good. If it refuses to disarm, we shall disarm it ourselves.”
            – Joseph Stalin-
            “The measures adopted to restore public order are: First of all, the elimination of the
            so-called subversive elements. … They were elements of disorder and subversion.
            On the morrow of each conflict I gave the categorical order to confiscate the largest
            possible number of weapons of every sort and kind. This confiscation, which
            continues with the utmost energy, has given satisfactory results.”
            -Benito Mussolini-
            “All political power comes from the barrel of a gun. The communist party must command all the guns, that way, no guns can ever be used to command the party.” -Mao Tze Tung-
            Keep blowing smoke up my azz Mike…

          • Mike

            I love how you feel that facts related to how many mass shootings is “blowing smoke”. No one has said that anyone should be completely disarmed. There could be a ban on some assault weapons without banning handguns, shotguns etc. There are other possible alternatives such as smart gun technology being mandatory for all weapons- this may not eliminate mass shootings but it may help to eliminate accidental shootings and suicides by gun. There is no one perfect solution, but doing nothing is not improving the situation and is helping to allow these mass shootings to occur. It is disconcerting that you would rather do nothing than look to find ways to curb gun violence in this country.

          • ipsd48

            You don’t pay very close attention:
            “If I could do it today, Mr and Mrs American, TURN IN YOUR GUNS!” -Nancy Pelosi

          • Mike

            that quote was actually senator Diane Feinstein. the funny thing again is that the right would rather do nothing and just accept unnecessary gun deaths. that is very sad for the pro life party.

          • ipsd48

            “As long as there are those in this world who will NOT disarm, we MAY not” -Alexander Hamilton

          • Alice Braddy

            Excellent Quotes!

          • Rodney Steward

            Cellphones have now surpassed DUI for car deaths, my state is in the process of making cellphones deaths the same as a DUI’s!

          • Mike

            Texas recently passed a law banning the use of cellphones while driving etc. Again there is a problem and we try to pass legislation to help. We have a problem with mass shootings but yet we have not passed any new gun laws to try and stem the mass shootings and gun deaths we experience in this country.

          • Rodney Steward

            Again, ONLY the bad guys will be well armed while the good guy pays the price like everywhere else in the world!

          • Lisa Meyer

            Banning the use of cell phones while driving is a useless “feel good” law. California passed that law some years ago, and people still drive/text/talk. And get into accidents. But you don’t hear anyone screaming to ban cell phones. As others have stated, banning weapons of any sort will only assure that only the criminals, who already don’t follow laws, will be the only one with guns.

          • Scuttlebutt

            About time—wish my state—Texas—would follow that example.

          • Rodney Steward

            It should be that way everywhere, it’s much worse than being reported by the news, like everything else!!

          • FloridaBoyee

            Have you EVER seen the data on these Mass shootings? The majority of killings have occurred in the cities that have GUN CONTROL!! CHICAGO, L.A., NYC, Washington, DC.Take those cities OUT of the percentages and we drop down to the levels of Japan! OH! GUN CONTROL WORKS!!! hahahaha.

          • will

            65% suicide
            9% police and self defence
            3% accidental
            The other 23%, about 9000 gun deaths. But 50% of the 9000 are killed by 3% of the population, 17 to 34 years of age about 10 million black men. The other 4,500 homicides committed by 97% of the population, about 320 million people.

          • Scuttlebutt

            The true problem is in this post from will—-thanks will:)

          • chucky001

            No use arguing with Trumptards, Mike. their brains are almost as tiny as their peni– er, hands. Yeah, let’s go with that.

          • Raymond Bell

            As per usual , just name calling, no substantive remedies and lots of anatomy misperceptions. The Liberals are communist , not progressives. And the only way to shut them up is stick a pacifier in their mouths.That was a micro aggression trigger, so go to your safe space and color awhile or take a 20 mg. Prozac and dumb down some more!

          • Scuttlebutt

            Great post Raymond:)

          • Raymond Bell

            Bullies do that. Name calling and repetitive talking points learned from MSM and when asked for an answer …run away to their safe space to color and to decompress from people that cause then
            micro aggressive” rebound! All demonstrations of too little attention when left in Day Care by their hopefully working
            two parents!

          • mac12sam12
          • Rodney Steward
          • Mike

            I am not sure what you were trying to show as two of the pages no longer exist and the other is the CNN main page. the truth is this country can do better with gun homicides.

          • Rodney Steward

            Yeah, they’ve been taken down and changed, they don’t keep this stuff up long now, like people are hiding things, these were mass killings in Germany and Paris, try this one IF it’s up, https://sputniknews.com/eur

          • will

            I think homicide is down overall cept LA and Chicago. But mass shooting may be up. It depends on your definition. By the medical dict its when one or more attack unarmed group and shoot multiple victims. So if one or more men in the course of a robbery kill more than one person in a group, that can be considered a mass shooting. Like the Bank of A in CA.

          • Scuttlebutt

            The Dem’s do NOT like numbers:):):) They would rather preach B.S. to us & expect everyone else to but their lie’s.

          • tCotUS

            Hummmm….. I must learn never argue with a Liberal…They don’t like logic, statistics, research, or an intelligent conversation. What do they like?

          • ipsd48

            Play doh and fuzzy bunnies

          • rational_being

            “The Dem’s do NOT like numbers:):):)” I disagree. They love numbers, as long as they get to choose them!

          • ipsd48

            airport ‘security’ is a joke. Last test of the TSA system 80% failed

          • Mike

            you are correct so is your solution then to just abandon it completely? not everything works but to continue to do nothing is ridiculous. we know nothing leads to more mass shootings and gun violence so doing nothing is not a solution.

          • tCotUS

            How True

          • chucky001

            Actually, if you were paying attention, self-driving cars are being tested in liberal bastions like SF. That looks like vehicle control to me.

          • ipsd48

            ………..or when knives are used in a murder………..even tho FBI statistic show more people killed by knives than guns

        • mac12sam12

          Chicago has the toughest gun regulations in the US. Last year there was 716 people killed by firearms, and 4,379 wounded. That’s just in the S. Side, Hussein O’s old neighborhood. The massacre was stopped by a NRA instructor. There could have been a lot more deaths if it wasn’t for him.

          • FloridaBoyee

            WOW!!! Obama’s Liberal MEDIA NEVER TALKS about that, DO THEY?

          • chucky001

            Or there could have been a lot less deaths if red states had laws like the blue states. Too easy to get a gun in those red states.

          • Retired

            Spewing out of your Ahole again , pull your pants up your mouth is showing .

          • mac12sam12

            There’s also much less gun crime in red states All gun crime happens in blue inner-cities with tough gun laws.

          • ipsd48

            Doesn’t matter WHAT state they’re bought in. FEDERAL LAW requires that EVERY gun shop submit a form to see if the buyer is banned from purchase

          • Retired

            30 shootings and 8 dead this last weekend and that does not include during the week , Rahm is another useless piece like Obama .

          • mac12sam12

            So it was a slow weekend!

          • Retired

            They hired a new Police chief that was supposedly a expert at calming things down , but so far nothing has changed . Our Democrats are so smart they do not See the problem that the open southern border creates in major US cities with a heavy Black population .

          • Scuttlebutt

            Your post is correct. What about the problem with blacks killing blacks in Chicago? Why is this allowed to continue? Nine out of ten were done by illegal guns—–ie—guns that were stolen, not purchased by the bad guy????

      • tCotUS

        We all know why there’s a cry for Gun Control….It’s actually should be called Politician Protection Control. .Politicians who violate the Constitution on a regular basis are getting worried. Guns in the hands of Patriots is a dangerous thing for Tyrants & Traitors. As they feel the noose tightening around their necks, they are getting worried & will push Gun Control for all they’re worth. They have the backing of Globalists, fore they know America must be disarmed before it can be taken.

        • Edward Marquez

          Amen ,That is the truth in a nut shell.The invasion to the U.S. could come from any direction of our country if the Patriots were disarmed

          • will

            Its already planted with in and uses the idiot left and Dems to slowly take over. It smiles when mentally ill people like Kelly help their cause. First attack free speech so our voice is taken away. Then taking the guns away will be easier.
            The 5 Phase plan which was captured in a Virginia terrorist home in circa 1991,
            that explains all. If you want to understand why the Saudi’s banned the muslim brotherhood yet covertly funnel 500 million a year into that which has 26 sub terror orgs in the US a year read, Siege at Mecca.

          • Simply_Sis

            I want to add that while the globalist elites can plan all they like, they can only succeed where citizens give up their faith in Almighty God. That is the reason for the liberal agenda against white Americans. Most are Christian. We have a Christian heritage. America has sent the gospel and missionaries throughout the whole world. That is our legacy and it is one that God is continuing to honor. To leave out Christianity in all this is to trust that man can do whatever he wants, which he cannot. Not when Christians are praying and fighting the good fight of faith. We’re the reason the globalist elite have not been able to succeed in their NWO schemes yet. We must be taken out of the way first, through the rapture of the Church. (This is biblical.) Once we are gone, the world is in a heap of trouble. It’ll be unbelievably violent and bloody. Worse than has ever been seen since the beginning of the world.

          • tCotUS

            A man’s country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle.
            -George William Curtis-

          • Norman

            demonicrats wrongly believe the almighty and powerful government is the country.

            Intelligent Americans like us, on the other hand, believe the country is the land, the people, the history, the traditions, and the economy in addition to the government.

            That is why we want a stable and powerful nation while the demonicrats want a powerful and expanding government but a weak nation.

          • tCotUS

            AGREED NORMAN…..WE HAVE SOMETHING LIBERALS WILL NEVER HAVE…FAITH IN EACH OTHER, & EVERYTHING YOU LISTED.

          • will

            Well if you believe in prophecy then you are preparing to die as it claims that evil will win. Maybe thats why we have so many in power that are siding with evil because they know good will lose on this planet. Yes it says he will return and defeat evil but not until Lucifer wins all four corners of the earth. You and I could missing heads by the time he returns. So if we are to die why not do a good deed on our way out.

          • chucky001

            Ever hear of separation of church and state? the founding fathers were far wiser than you, “sis”. And what’s this about the world being violent once you’re gone? Take your ugly head out of your butt and take a look around – it already is! Unless you’re too in love with the smell of your own farts…

          • There is actually no separation of church and state but in the minds of those that … And the violence you are seeing today is nothing compared to what is coming for USA.
            The 9/11/01 attack was the first of three major attacks, the second will be approx. 1000 times greater…. The third attack, well, just pray that it will be quick.
            God has never allowed the destruction of a nation nor of it’s people before first sending His warnings, hoping that the hearts of the people might turn to Him.
            He has been warning USA since the mid 1980s but very few are listening.

            The Bible tells us that the fool says, there is no God and that is wisdom is but foolishness to Him.
            Luke 12:5 – But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.

          • Norman

            Take your ugly head out of your own butt and read Simply-Sis’s comment again, chucky. Sis typed, “We have a Christian heritage.” Sis did NOT type that we have a Christian government. Sis is far wiser than you, chucky.

          • ipsd48

            separation of church and state is NOT in the constitution, the bill of rights or the declaration of independence. It was a phrase in a letter from Thomas Jefferson concerning the political force used to support the Church of England in the colonies…………regardless of the taxpayer’s religious preference.

          • will

            If we are not taken in the rapture we suffer a horrible death. Then when Christ arrives you are what, brought back to life to die again in the final battle of evil? Death may be easy but dying is not, been there done that. Then a thousands years in nothingness to rise again and get heaven or hell. You could fight for Christ twice and die twice, and still be sent to hell. Maybe this is why Obama, Pelosi, Schumer and the millions of other evil people have abandoned Christ. At least they get one life wealthy before dying once and reigning in hell with Lucifer.

          • Raymond Bell

            The Globalist and especially “Demonist HRC and her crime associates” are in for an enlightening surprise when the continued false flag murders of people at concerts , in churches. on bike paths,& Malls fail to make the people beg for protection. The US people i.e. veterans, police, National guard, and millions of patriots will cease your insane, puppet , mind controlled agenda and strike back to a again rejoice in a Democratic Republic and abide by the Law of Our Constitution. The “swamp” in the District of Criminals, will be cleaned out of
            Career political thieves and tax funneling parasites!

          • chucky001

            Demonist HRC? Don’t you mean demonist Trump?

          • Dennis Martinez

            No, Trump might be Repugnant to some but HRC is definitely Demonic!!

          • rockyndallas

            You should seek professional help. Or maybe just get back on your medications.

          • Raymond Bell

            You find value in a criminal of 30+years, who lies like she has no ethical or moral sensibilities? Then chucky …you are a lost soul too!

          • chucky001

            Stupid post. Privately owned guns are no match for helicopter gunships, tanks, drones, ICBMs or special forces that an enemy could bring to bear.

          • Retired

            AKs twin Troll has arrived !!!

          • Rodney Steward

            And just as sick and stupid!

          • Norman

            Stupid post, chucky. Helicopters and tanks must be fueled, rearmed, maintained, and operated by humans who are no match for the massive fire that privately-owned firearms could bring to bear if the US was invaded.

            FYI, only know-nothing liberal news reporters and YOU call them “helicopter gunships”. We always called them attack helicopters in the Army.

          • Rodney Steward

            And some can even be brought down by a single ARROW!! If you’ve ever been in the Air Force you know right what to go for!! 🙂

          • Norman

            Unlike in the movies, bullets just don’t spark and ricochet off the thin aluminum-alloy skin of helicopters.

            Except the tail, which is mostly hollow, it is nearly impossible to shoot through an attack helicopter and not hit something. They do have armor plates around critical components but there are many big gaps between the plates.

          • Rodney Steward

            Exactly my friend!! These toys go down regularly!!

          • ipsd48

            Sure do. During Dewey Canyon II I counted as many as 35 burnt out hueys and cobras airlifted back to Quang Tri a day

          • Rodney Steward

            My God, that’s a pile of them and know there was a lot of dead!

          • mrpoohead

            Please get in a helicopter and someone give me a gun.

        • mary murphy

          Very interesting and provocative reply. Lots of truth in it.

        • Simply_Sis

          Yes, the Bible tells us the STRONG MAN must first be bound before his goods can be stolen. America is a prime example of a strong man. The liberals are a prime example of the thief. Americans have been bound by government regulation to the point of death to our free market enterprise. I am grateful Almighty God has given us a reprieve through President Trump! It probably will not last for long, but as long as it is here, we have got to get behind his agenda with all that is within us. This is our only chance of survival. After this, the NWO and the Antichrist will come on the scene to destroy the world through his anarchy.

          I say this because it is imperative for people to know, repent now and accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The benefits are every conceivable one that can be thought on. Almighty God is the SOURCE of all good things. If a person is not a Christian when Jesus comes for the Church – then everyone will still have a chance to be saved, but only if they do NOT take the Mark of the Beast (The book of Revelations speaks about this in the Bible). No one who takes the Mark of the Beast can be saved. Ever. Reject it and call on Jesus Christ for salvation and you will be saved, but it will probably cause your death because the Antichrist will have everyone put to death who rejects it (the bible says they’ll be beheaded – we all know that is a favorite method of death by Muslims, so they’re probably be the NWO’s religion).

          Don’t wait for the Tribulation to accept Jesus Christ. Call on Him today and escape the Tribulation AND receive eternal life through Jesus Christ. That is the real reward for all who call on the name of the Lord. God Himself will be with you to preserve you for all eternity where you will experience the power of an endless life. Jesus promises that we will forever be with Him and that He goes to prepare a mansion for all who believe (no shacks).

          • chucky001

            Someone is off her meds.

          • Retired

            That would be you not taking their meds , but the is no med that can cure a sick Ahole .Only cure is to put you down like a sick animal .

        • Clyde Ernde

          tCotUS You my friend hit the nail on the head, Politicians against the Constitution, Tyrants n Traitors We have a Government full of these Communists Traitors Liberals and Rhinos. One Hundred Million Gun owners can’t be wrong

          • tCotUS

            My friend the swamp must be drained. Hopefully with our support, it will be done.

      • Simply_Sis

        You may as well ask the sun not to rise tomorrow morning or a leopard to change it’s spots. Not possible. They know where their bread is buttered and they will play gun toting heroes and heroines and villains from now until Kingdom come if it will give them the lifestyle they so desperately crave – and all the while morally lecturing us on the evils of gun ownership. They’re bought and paid for by the globalist elite, which means you might want to reconsider supporting them (same as the NFL kneelers) because they’re ultimately anti-Americans who are financing and supporting the overthrow of America (which is what either of their candidates, Hillary and/or Bernie, would have been glad to do).

      • Angela K

        Exactly!! Perfectly put!!

      • Tom Schuckman

        I agree with your sound, logical statements, completely, sir ! I am a Disabled Vietnam Combat Veteran: 68-70, Huey Helicopter, ‘door gunner.’ Ha! The Army told us that Vietnam would be a “Paradise,” —LOL ! I also write a Christian based Blog: TOM’S JOURNAL, that endeavors to help other disabled Veterans and others. My email: tschuckman@aol.com — And I still struggle with the local VAMC system and so-called, ‘doctors’ in Northern Michigan, to get treated with respect and some dignity, as they usually use a “broad brush” when they hand down decrees on how to administer needed medicines that so many Vet’s need. What a 3 ring circus….. sorry.
        I also carry a CCW permit, and defend the U.S. Constitution and especially our 2nd Amendment RIGHTS ! —Tommy Schuckman. “Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth ?” —Galatians 4: 16.

      • Scuttlebutt

        How about “require” everyone to join the Military & “learn” what is real life? How many of these “showbiz” idiots have served our Country???? NONE:(:(:(

        • FloridaBoyee

          Scuttlebutt, It has always been my feeling that ALL teenagers serve in the military at least 2 years!! FIRST of all, it separates them from Momma!! It teaches them HOW to live on their own and how to actually learn something, not be taught by a LIBERAL IDIOT, who has NEVER done anything in their life other than read from LIBERAL books!! Thanks!

    • Lynne Gillooly

      Sadly, President Trump cut back on the funding Obama put in place for Mental health. (google it please) What is sad is people believe democrats are against the 2nd amendment and that is a lie. As a gun owner and a democrat I get angry when I hear that. Why can’t we agree on getting assault weapons off the street.

      • Retired

        You just don’t get it , I have had a gun for 50 years and it has never bin fired . The Gun Grabbers would have you with a single shot rifle or pistol . Everything to the gun grabbers is a assault weapon . This last guy was a nut cake and it was a hate crime .What needs to happen is the Insurance companies need to pay for mental health care . We had two Hospitals in town and in the 80s both shut down the mental health wards . One of the Hospitals had just spent millions on improving the mental health floor and shut it down . Lets take cars away as they kill more than guns ????

        • Lynne Gillooly

          I totally agree with you about mental health but the GOP keeps cutting and cutting funding so they can give their wealthy constituents a tax cut over and over again. They care more about profits for their insurance friends than they do about average Americans.

          • Retired

            You have to remember the Insurance industry has fought mental health coverage since the early 80s , and who is a major contributer to the political parties .The last Three President as well as congress are afraid to step on the toes of the industry .

          • Lynne Gillooly

            that is why we need Medicare For All. Let the Govt. be the insurance company and keep the delivery of healthcare private and competitive.

          • Retired

            First insurance needs a swift kick in the rear and allow across the border policies . But Congress is to blame for that , something the media will not write about as they are to busy bashing Trump .

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Selling insurance across state lines will do NOTHING to stop their greed. We are the only country that’s citizens go bankrupt or just die due to medical bills. Hoe exceptional is that? Medicare is extremely popular. Why not let people below 65 have the same option.?

          • Retired

            Congress and the Insurance lobby will not allow it ,just like you can NOT buy a supplement policy unless you are on Medicare . Americans have been duped that national health insurance is bad . Putting everyone on Medicare would drive up the price and hurt the Elderly as many do not have much left from their SS .

          • ipsd48

            ………….and the present interest rates are forcing many back into the workforce because what they saved for retirement will no longer generate enough interest to support them

          • Retired

            Thank the IMF/IMG and World Central Bank for that , as it is not only in the US with low interest rates .

          • William Burke

            “The only country that’s (sic) citizens go bankrupt or just die due to medical bills”. I have thousands of dollars in unpaid medical bills I can never pay and none of them have killed me!

            So Zimbabwe takes care of all its citizens’ medical needs? Argentina? Tajikistan? Kiribati? Why drown any valid points you may have to make in gross distortion of reality?

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Excuse me…the only advanced country.. Many people die because they do not go to a doctor when they need to. That is a reality. The estimate is 45,000 per yr will die because they cannot afford to get treatment. I believe it is much higher than that.

          • William Burke

            And I am likely one of them. I have only seen a doctor in the past twenty years when I was too seriously hurt to ignore it. (A broken wrist in a fall down steps, hit by a car crossing at a green light, etc.) I went to the ER last winter when I’d had bronchitis for weeks on end, and wasn’t getting better. An examination and 3 hours of steroid treatments resulted in a bill for nearly five and a half thousand dollars! My Social Security is $800 a month – they have finally figured out they are not getting anything out of me!

            My problem with governmental solutions is the usual one: they always screw it up and make things worse. I have no confidence in governmental solutions . . . and why should I?

          • Lynne Gillooly

            We have been manipulated by corporate media to hate government for the last 30 yrs. Why? So the for profit private companies take over everything. The sad thing is we cannot tell a private company what they can and cannot do, but we do have a voice when it is a public entity.

          • William Burke

            Time for you to hit the history archives! The number of people now believed to have been killed by their own governments in the century prior to our present one: in excess of 260 million! I don’t know how many exclamation points I should place after that figure, so I stopped at one.

            No corporations can ever aspire to touch a figure such as that one. GOVERNMENTS KILL.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            I am well aware of the many Wars and genocides that have occurred in history. Our own Govt. has been guilty in this regard, but we are discussing health insurance.

          • William Burke

            Health insurance, fine. Medical mis/mal/nonfeasance is the number one cause of death in the United States.

          • Tired…

            You brought the government into it when you suggested that they provide health insurance, so his point is valid. The VA is a microcosm of what happens when the government runs healthcare. The insurance companies are a problem, but turning everything over to the government is jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            The VA system is nothing like Medicare for all. The government owns the VA facilities , hires the workers and Doctors and controls the delivery of care.
            Medicare for all is JUST letting the government be the insurance company. It does NOT own the hospitals or equipment nor does it employ the Doctors, nurses or any medical person delivering care. i AGREE with you. I do not want the Govt. controlling our care or getting involved with the free market when it comes to healthcare.

          • ipsd48

            The reality is that it’s much easier to sue a hospital for malpractice than sue the govt for malpractice…………………….and hospitals don’t get to pay THEIR lawyers with YOUR money

          • Mathew Molk

            Net you kneel down when the national anthem is played.

            Commie go home- North Korea is calling you

          • ipsd48

            You think the govt has a good record on healthcare?
            Are you aware the govt JUST approved treatment for people injured in chemical weapons testing………………………IN THE 50s?!

          • FloridaBoyee

            THESE are the people who wine, dine & feed the Politicians for THEIR own benefits!! LOBBYING has been going on for YEARS and it gets worse EVERYDAY!

          • ipsd48

            Sure we do. And then the govt ignores us.

          • Tired…

            And the other side of the coin is to factor in how many die in hospitals due to medical errors and nosicomial infections. If memory serves, at one point it was estimated at about 200,000 per year. While that does not mean that people shouldn’t go to hospitals, there is a balance here that we need to seek.

          • Mathew Molk

            I remember when insurance was called “Hospitalization” and not hobby go to the doctor when you get a splinter in your finger.

            The fact is we, as a nation, go to the doctor FAR to much. – Fall down in the snow. “You better go to the hospital and get checked out” Checked out for what? You are walking and talking and nothing hurts but your keester. What test do they give you for a bruised backside?

          • Mathew Molk

            You are totally full of shit! NOBODY who is in acute distress is turned away from an emergency room.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            That is right. Millions of uninsured go without check ups or medicine because they cannot afford it. They get sicker and sicker and suddenly are in acute distress and have no choice but to go to the ER. If they make it they are stuck with a massive bill they cannot pay. What kind of healthcare is that?

          • Tired…

            Greed is in the heart and greedy people gravitate toward power. When all of the power is in the government, where will the greedy people go? Our undereducated youth believe that socialism will work if we just have ‘the right people’ in charge. The problem is that such people do not exist.

          • Mathew Molk

            You are a NWO Commie, Right? – Greed is the very best thing we can have when they are forced to compete for our hard earned. The company with the best product at the lowest price will get the clients. The others will have to step up to the plate if they want to get the business. Free capitalism has never lost a battle with government consoled communism.

            We the people spoke at in the 2016 election. We do not want the nanny state.

          • will

            My medicare completely failed after obama care. No doctors in my town would except my ins. The closet doctor was 55 miles and a specialist. I had to return to the VA to get even basic help

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Sorry, but Obamacare has NOTHING TO DO with the Medicare program.

          • JMICHAEL270

            There are too many undeserving young people on Medicare that are draining the system, I see that every day I work.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Medicare is for people over 65. Do you mean Medicaid?

          • JMICHAEL270

            You just stated let everyone under 65 have Medicare did you not?

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Yes I did. I was responding to your post that said “there are too many undeserving young people on Medicare”. Since Medicare is ONLY FOR older people I thought you probably meant to say Medicaid. (for poor and disabled at any age)

          • ipsd48

            That’s because ins actuaries don’t set their prices by state lines, rather by risk areas.

          • Mathew Molk

            What’s that last name? You are looNy all right. Ever take a look at the fantastic health care the government has in the VA? The government screws up everything it touches. Keep the Feds out of healthcare and anything else I have to depend on. Check out the DOJ and FIB(Not a typo) Even on a state level the cackling witch would be serving her second year of a 40 year sentence.

          • will

            communism seems to fail you are reading political ads
            Look up and read about medicare and welfare fraud and you will see we must find a new approach

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Communism??? Every other industrialized country provides healthcare for its citizens with BETTER outcomes. How is that communism?

          • JMICHAEL270

            If you think that’s true Lynne, why don’t you pack up and move to one of those wonderful countries.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Why should I leave my country? It is far more Patriotic to stay and try to make it better.

          • ipsd48

            that’s communist propaganda

          • JMICHAEL270

            Wrong, in order to fix our healthcare our elected officials should be required to have the same insurance as we the people, that is the fastest way to fix this GAM Obama and the Dems saddled us with.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Obamacare was a GOP idea in the 90’s. Written by the Heritage Foundation and implemented by Romney in MA. It is much better than what we had because it did not allow insurance companies to put caps on annual and lifetime spending, keep kids on plan to 26 instead of 18 and no more junk policies. Sadly, Obama kept the for profit insurance companies in the middle instead of going for single payer.

          • ipsd48

            And the Heritage Foundation abandoned the idea as unworkable

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Where did you read that? i think you just made it up

          • ipsd48

            From the Heritage Foundation.
            That’s the problem with depending on left wing sources. They never tell the whole story.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            I suppose that is why Romney implemented the same program in MA. when he was Governor… The ACA was meant to protect us from being screwed by the insurance industry. I have no idea why we would not want that. Going back to what we had will be terrible for most of us. Sadly mot people do not recognize the benefits because they have been lied to by the GOP and rightwing media.

          • ipsd48

            A program that was ALREADY failing before dems locked the GOP out when writing obamacare

          • ipsd48

            Well, that would be a good FIRST step

          • ipsd48

            After all, the germans had such a GREAT healthcare system under the Nazis. Especially for jews, gypsies, mental cases and gays

          • Jim Tuggle

            I call b/s on your statement. You are a fool at best and deluded at worst.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            what statement do you disagree with?

          • Retired

            Where is the bill with the facts ????

          • Mike

            the Senate and congress have both released their bills and they have already been analyzed and show exactly what was written previously that the wealthy get the majority if the tax breaks. in fact an estimated 21percent of middle class families will see a tax increase.

          • Retired

            Right now it is still up in the air as far as getting to the Pres. desk to sign . The only way to do it is Eliminate the present code and write a BRAND NEW CODE .

            p

          • ipsd48

            Senate is still working on their bill, but some of the proposals have been released

          • Mike

            http://www.wesh.com/article/cbo-house-gop-tax-plan-would-add-to-debt/13450871
            In fact the CBO has stated it will add more than 1.7 trillion to the deficit which is actually more than the GOP has allowed themselves to do so under the current rules to avoid the need for senate Democrats to vote for the bill. There are several analyses being done on the tax bills that have been presented by the House and Senate. It is not one bill yet and that could change the analyses but the overwhelming consensus is that the wealthiest will get a large tax cut while the middle class will get a negligible tax cut and in some cases a tax increase.

          • Retired

            There is only one way to solve the problem and that is to get rid of the old IRS mess and start completely NEW as it will just add to more confusion come tax time .

          • Mike

            and that solution is to give the rich enormous tax breaks at the expense of the middle class? at least that is the Republican solution at this point.

          • Retired

            Mike >>> Don’t forget about all the Rich Democrats that also love those tax breaks . Start with Hollywood – Sports People – Market Boys and Bankers that Clinton trough Obama bailed out instead of Prison !!!

          • ipsd48

            The CBO also came back and corrected their errors and found most everyone WOULD get a tax cut. I don’t suppose that info has reached the leftist think tanks yet though.

          • Mike

            you are not even good at making things up. the COB has NOT scored the tax bill yet.

          • disqus_htVNWSBEmM

            Wrong! Everyone gets a tax cut. Everyone benefits and if the government does not get our money by increased they can’t waste it or steal it,

          • Lynne Gillooly

            i wish you were correct, but 80 percent of the cuts will go to the very wealthy and large corporations. I thought Trump would stand behind what he said at his rallies about the middle class and working families so I was shocked at this Tax plan.

          • Retired

            There is not a bill yet gone through Congress ,so do you have a crystal ball without facts or are you swallowing what the media writes ????

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Economists have read the Bill. I am not an economist, but I can read their opinions. I can also remember when trickle down economics did NOT work during Reagan’s and W’s administration. Governor Brownback in Kansas implemented a tax plan close to this one and it collapsed the Kansas economy and destroyed the budget. You don’t need a crystal ball when so much evidence is available.

          • Retired

            Give us the Bill No. that has his the floor and ready for Trump to sign , or is it another WE HAVE TO PASS IT TO SEE WHAT IS IN IT ?????

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Just Google “GOP Tax Bill’ and you can read it

          • Retired

            Right now it is still a political football up in the air and not ready to be signed by the president .

          • ipsd48

            I’ve already read it, and analyized it. But that isn’t the bill that the president will sign. Senate still has to pass their version. Then it has to go through reconciliation. Only THEN will the bill hit Mr Trump’s desk

          • ipsd48

            there isn’t one………………..yet

          • Retired

            You and I know that , but the Media guppies don’t follow what is going on and with Turkey day coming up it is doubtful and after that come Xmas and new years . That means that more than likely it will be the end of the tax cuts .The elected have no plans to do much next year other than raise campaign Money .

          • ipsd48

            Lib media claimed they knew what was in the bill 2 weeks ago…………..even tho the House version just came out a few days ago

          • Mathew Molk

            Doubt you ever worked at all but I never for a contract or a job from a homeless bum, but I made money working for large and small corporations and rich people.

            Just how many of the “poor” gave you a job and paid you for it?

          • Lynne Gillooly

            I have worked all my life. My dad was a Veteran and a carpenter with 8th grade education. I was an XRAY Tech. Then I was an Ultrasound tech and for the last 20 yrs I have owned a small business selling medical equipment while raising 4 kids . I get screwed by health insurance every month ($1281.00) I had 1 MRI last yr and had to pay the whole $4000.00 due to the deductible. We should all be ashamed and angry at the for profit system we have while so many other countries realize healthcare should be a right and not a priviledge for the wealthy only.

          • JMICHAEL270

            Thank Obama and his minions who forced the ACA on us all, not once was a republican included in The structuring or content of Obamacare.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Look it up. I don’t mean Fox news or talk radio.

          • ipsd48

            Naturally YOUR company doesn’t make any profits, right?
            Don’t be a hypocrite.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Of course I try to make s profit, but my comment was about Healthcare. Most countries recognize healthcare as a right for its citizens and be just another profit motivated industry. That is not hypocritical.
            Do you think it is ok for Americans to pay $6000 for a medicine that costs $139 in other countries? We should be outraged at this, but we all just take it like sheep.

          • disqus_htVNWSBEmM

            Wait until it passes and see what it is. To condemn it before it is passed says that you are not going to like whatever is passed.

          • Retired

            Some have their mind made up before the event happens ,if it happens . Neither side wants to clean up the tax code . Best would be throw out the old and start fresh to eliminate the loop holes Congress enjoys .

          • Mike

            it is not our minds being made up as there is already analyses that show it will overwhelmingly benefit the wealthiest americans at the expense of the middle class.

          • Retired

            So why not eliminate and start fresh instead of more garbage ????

          • Mike

            I cannot argue against that. It does not seem that Trump, Republicans or Democrats have the will to do such a thing, but it may very well be time to do so.

          • ipsd48

            You ignore the fact that this isn’t TRUMP’s tax plan. It’s Ryan’s tax plan. And McConnel is pushing an equally bad one in the senate.
            Time will tell if they can hash out something workable. Only thing we can be sure of it the dems will oppose it no matter WHAT it looks like.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            When Trumps base and the middle class realize they are getting totally screwed so that the billionaire donors are happy Trump will claim it was not his idea.. That is what he does. Never will take responsibility. The Senate version is a little bit better for the average American, but both of these Bills are huge gifts to their wealthy donors and Trump himself.

          • ipsd48

            Guess I should have expected it. When faced with reality you wander off into a rant.

          • San T Klaws

            The numbers are just in…Trumps cuts will add 1.7 trillion to the deficit.
            Who do you think will need to pay that down now we know that the wealthy don’t pay tax on offshore trusts?

            Hint -You.

          • ipsd48

            $1.5 trillion……….over 10 years. Kinda refreshing after Obama’s trillion dollar + deficits

          • San T Klaws

            So “fiscally responsible” conservatives are going to make the deficit $1.7 trillion HIGHER, even though Obama reduced it by two thirds since 2009.

            And the rationale is “BUT OBAMA…”

            You really can’t fix stoopid.

          • mac12sam12

            A very dishonest statement. President Trump wants everyone to get a tax break, the middle class, businesses and corporations. That give businesses a lot of leeway to grow and hire people. When you mention tax cuts it’s a dog whistle for democrats. “he’s just giving the rich a tax break!” Turn off CNN.

          • Mike

            It is not a dishonest statement at all as the tax plan that has been put forth by the House has already been analyzed and has been shown to give the majority of the tax breaks to the wealthiest Americans while the middle class will either get a small tax break or in many cases a tax increase. Tax cuts will not grow the economy long term and have never done so. They do provide a short term bump in the economy but they are not going to bring long term growth especially when the middle class is getting only a very small part of the overall tax cut plan.

          • ipsd48

            That ‘analysis’ was done by a rabid leftist think tank. Hardly a neutral opinion.

          • Mike

            don’t believe the right it was a bipartisan group that has analyzed tax policy for years. even Gary Cohn has admitted some middle class families will see tax increases, but you keep putting your head in the sand so trump can give himself and his cronies a huge tax cut at your expense.

          • ipsd48

            There was nothing ‘bipartisan’ about that group. Two sides of the same rabid liberal coin.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Companies are already sitting on record breaking profits. They are buying back their stocks to inflate the value, but they are not paying higher wages or expanding. Why do they need even more money? Wake up! The GOP has done this before and it DID NOT WORK.

          • Mike

            You are correct Lynne, but I have spoken to mac12 before and he believes wholeheartedly that tax cuts will yield 4 to 6% growth which is ridiculous. Even in the Trump administration they are touting the need to get to 3% growth regularly. Tax cuts will as they always have done yield a brief increase in the rate of growth in this country, but they will blow an even bigger whole in our deficit while funneling money to the wealthiest of Americans. They will not produce any lasting effect. they have never before in our country and they did not in Kansas so they will not this time either.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            I agree. We have tried this before and it did NOT work. What will happen next is the GOP will complain about deficits and want to CUT CUT CUT services to American citizens. I honestly do not know why so few on the top need billions of dollars at the expense of families trying to get by on low wages. It is very sad.

          • ipsd48

            Go ahead and try to run YOUR budget the way the govt runs OURS. Just be ready to lose your home to foreclosure

          • Lynne Gillooly

            I would do a lot better than Trump and the GOP plan… All of a sudden they do not care about doubling the debt and adding 1.5 trillion to the deficit so their wealthy friends can buy another house or airplane that they NEED

          • mac12sam12

            Wages have gone up and companies are begging for workers. dailyjobfix.com When workers compete for jobs, wages go down, When companies compete for workers, wages go up. Capitalism 101.

            “Done before then didn’t work.” It worked for JFK and Reagan. When they lowered taxes the GDP went up. Trump’s two GDPs were over 3% and will go to 4-5% after taxes are cut. Obama’s averaged under 1.5%.

          • Mike

            We are at very low unemployment rates which are currently at about 4.2% and wages have not been going up at a commensurate fashion. Once again you tout the idea of 4 to 5% growth which is nonsense. As for Trump’s first quarter growth was at 1.2% and then 2.6% in the second quarter. He did not reach 3 percent until the latest quarter which was 3.1%. That is good I am not disputing that but not as good as you claim; In addition Obama hit 3 percent growth 8 times in various quarters so having it for a quarter does not mean it is sustainable. Tax cuts again will give a small boost initially but they will not sustain growth.

          • ipsd48

            You forget already that we had a surfeit of over 9 million workers due to Obama’s polices?

          • Lynne Gillooly

            If the tax cuts were focused on the middle class and working families I would agree with you. It would cause a big increase in demand because millions would have money to buy products and services. Unfortunately, the very wealthy tend to park their money in tax havens or investments which doesn’t increase demand/ growth

          • mac12sam12

            They are focused on the middle class. Corporations and businesses don’t pay taxes, they pass those taxes off to the consumer. You pay! Higher taxes don’t create prosperity because that means less money in the economy. The consumer also pays for regulations and that’s why President Trump has rescinded 814 of them.

          • Mike

            Most large and medium sized companies pay almost no effective tax rate once they calculate in deductions etc so a tax cut although welcome for them is not going to trickle down to the middle class. the tax cuts are focused on two groups corporations and the wealthiest Americans. if you wan to cut the corporate tax rate I do not believe it will have much impact but fine go ahead and cut it, but they are also giving the wealthiest Americans millions in tax cuts while the middle class will see very little additional money and in some cases will actually have a tax increase.

          • ipsd48

            If everybody got what they wanted in tax changes NOBODY would pay taxes…………..and most would receive a rebate anyway.
            But that ain’t gonna happen

          • Lynne Gillooly

            By that logic wages would have increased after Reagan and W’s tax cuts. In fact they went down. Same is going on in Kansas. We are totally ignoring the demand side of the equation. If people don’t have extra money they cannot buy goods and services. It is not charity to give the cuts to lower income people. It is good economic policy. Dean Baker, Paul Krugman, Tom Piketty, and Bill Burnett (Reagan advisor) ALL SAY THIS IS A BAD DEAL except for the wealthy and large corporations

          • mac12sam12

            Wages did go up. How will giving more money to the government bring wages up? High taxes means more poverty, just look at the last 8 years of record poverty.

            And like I said, the consumer pays the business and corporate tax so your call to stick it to corporations is shooting yourself in the foot.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            They did not go up. Please google it. I f you give the tax cuts to the middle class and working families they end up spending more (increase demand) which means more customers for corporations which will cause growth. Either way the money goes to the companies, but at least millions more benefit.

          • mac12sam12

            Those companies will expand and hire with the extra business and hire duh. Explain how giving the government more money will help the economy. It doesn’t. Your way of thinking is what destroyed the middle class the past 8 years, high taxes and regulations up the ying yang.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            Try and focus…I never said give the government more money. I said give the tax cuts to the middle and working class INSTEAD of the giant corporate tax cuts. They already have record breaking profits and plenty of money. Giving them more money will not grow the economy, but if the money goes to regular people they will spend it and the economy will grow. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

          • mac12sam12

            You don’t seem to get it. Lowering the business and corporate tax rate benefits everyone, including the poor. If they’re getting record profits isn’t that the goal of all business? Should we make it illegal?

            When taxes are cut the GDP will hit 4% and Trump’s had two quarters over 3%. Trump is doing a good job.

          • Lynne Gillooly

            We have done this multiple times and it has not trickled down. That is why we are in the mess we are in. There is no sense discussing this with you because you refuse to look at the facts. Sadly, the big corporations do not expand and hire more people when they get a big tax cut. They hoard the money or park it overseas.

          • ipsd48

            Between 1980 and 2005 my income, when working for others, increased by 350%. Which was nothing compared to what I made when working for myself: 900% increase.
            Those who saw NO increase during that period must not have been worth what they were paid to start with.

          • ipsd48

            And hundreds of billions in new costs due to regulations

          • ipsd48

            Now you’re quoting the left, not the BLS. Wages DID go up, even if less than the incomes of the top 1%

          • ipsd48

            In truth, many corporations minimize or eliminate their tax liability by donating money to charities. Makes sense to me. They can’t do any worse helping people than the govt does.

          • ipsd48

            The proposed tax plan would DOUBLE the standard deduction. For most filers that would be an increase in deductions even without the individual deduction.
            As for the elimination of the medical deduction, it was already a nightmare under Obamacare.The elimintation was devised by McConnal and Ryan. Don’t blame that on Trump.He promised a medical deduction for EVERYONE

          • ipsd48

            If Ins companies are sitting on such huge profits why are the biggest ones all bailing out of Obamacare? Companies don’t abandon policies that WORK

          • ipsd48

            trump just stopped the govt payouts to ins companies. And did the left ever scream

      • will

        Lynne that money was probably wasted. Once Obama care is gone and new plan is in place you might see a big change for mental and drug use. He already declared a national emergency more than Bush and Obama combined. I have seen commercials for addicts to call already. When trade is fixed and allot more of the medicare fraud is tackled we can push for more mental health. But be careful we are not just creating a new way for the industry to suck tax payer money

      • JMICHAEL270

        Lynne you are going off the reservation, this discussion is not about healthcare.

        • Lynne Gillooly

          Medicare IS healthcare for 65 and older.

      • ipsd48

        You mean Obama’s plan to strip vets and retirees of their 2nd amendment rights because they had someone else pay their bills?

    • pappy450

      AGREED! They are closing mental health hospitals at a breakneck pace “to save MONEY”, and turning these people out on the streets to fend for themselves. Seen this firsthand here in N.Y. State. Many of these people are NOT wanted by their families because they are a danger to the family as well as themselves. (and the communities they are DUMPED in.)

    • Mike

      actually they did. obamacare made mental health treatment the same as medical care. the benefits are now the same and there are no limits on mental health coverage as there were before.

      • Tired…

        I work in the mental health field and, while that may have been the intent, that is not true in the world I work in every day.

        • Mike

          I work in mental health insurance industry and it did happen. the issue is one of access and unless we had a single payer system the free market decides what areas can financially support a mental health facility or psychiatrists and therapists.

          • Tired…

            I never said it didn’t happen; what I attempted to communicate was that the policy didn’t effectively trickle down to the clients and providers. While I was not an Obama fan, I agreed with his argument that mental health is just as important as physical health. Although a single payer system has some advantages, is has some disadvantages as well. Personally I prefer freedom over government run healthcare.

          • Retired

            Where I live we have 3 hospitals and not one mental health floor , how is it in your area ???? It is the in house care that is needed . Same problem as Drug and Alcohol wards . We send Drunk Drivers to Prison instead of rehab because Insurance Co. do not want to pay for in house treatment of all three situations .

          • Tired…

            Two hospitals but part of the same health system; one has an extensive mental health and substance abuse programs. While the need exists for better solutions, forced rehab doesn’t work any better than prison. It is incredibly difficult for those who struggle with addiction to break free, even when they genuinely want to do so; without the desire to even try it will fail every time. Perhaps we need to rethink our love affair with alcohol and other drugs so that we can nip the problem before it starts. Unfortunately we can’t even agree to stop romanticizing drug use; a commonsense approach will never happen until we are committed to changing the way we think.

          • Retired

            Addiction has to be a long term procedure , and like in our state insurance would not go over 2 weeks and out patient does not work as well . I always ask who is in control of our health , the Dr. or the Insurance Co.. The Answer is the Insurance .

          • Tired…

            I love these people, but addicts have to overcome their ambivalence or they will not succeed. Their recovery is in their hands, not the doctor’s or the insurance company’s. Unfortunately it is often a dependence on others that keeps them from succeeding, although I do agree that we should not place barriers in front of those who are committed to their own health.

      • Tired…

        This is true but it is only part of the story, because Democrats put people out on the streets as well. In my town the state mental hospital was forced to close by the Obama Administration (who actually went to court to do so); at least one patient died as a result.

        • Mike

          what hospital? please provide some proof of this because I have not heard that and am interested in this information.

          • Retired

            It can be true as insurance is in control , we went trough this many decades ago , remember ins. policies do not cross borders even they sell in another state .

          • Tired…

            Google “Virginia must close 4 of its 5 training centers”

            One thing that you should know is that the individuals were in these facilities precisely because they could not be housed elsewhere in the community. The staff who took care of and loved these patients were devastated.

          • Retired

            Glad that I left that screwed up state . To many Democrat fools and they proved it again yesterday with the election .

          • Tired…

            Wasn’t a shock. The state went for Hillary in 2016 and voted in a Democratic Governor, Lt. Governor, and Attorney General in the previous election cycle. Gillespie wasn’t a great candidate in the first place. However, if we could get rid of NOVA, we would have a much better state. Do you think that we could give NOVA to DC?

          • Mike

            This is fascinating but this does state in the settlement that the people in these facilities were being restrained and denied any free will in some instances over their lives. I am not saying that the staff was necessarily incorrect in how they cared for them, but the investigation by the Justice Department revealed many awful allegations against the facilities.

          • Tired…

            The article is not as believable when you are this close to the story. I understand that article is all you have to go on, but this was a hot button topic in the community for months and I can tell you the rational given for closing the facility carries zero weight in this town.

          • Tired…

            My full post actually contained the following comment, but some of it was deleted from the post above. If anyone else can see this in the original post, I apologize for the redundancy. “The article is not as believable when you are this close to the story and the people involved. Perhaps one of the issues is why there weren’t any corrective actions allowed to address the alleged abuses. Wouldn’t it make sense to allow the state to make the necessary adjustments rather than default to closing the facilities? Most of the individuals housed in the local facility are not able to function in a group home, much less in a less restrictive environment. I understand the article is all you have to go on, but this was a hot button topic in the community for months and I can tell you the rational given for closing the facility carries zero weight in this town.”

          • Mike

            I agree and there are always two sides to every story. I think the idea of the disabled or those with mental health issues-non violent being moved to the community is a good thing IF we have the infrastructure in housing and support they require. the problem is we don’t make that investment to make it work.

          • Tired…

            I think that there is some validity to your observations, but in the particular case that I mentioned, some of these individuals were bedridden: Where are you going to place them in the community that will upgrade their lives? In addition, we have to balance our finances. I have no doubt that we could reroute some money from the federal government, but no one wants it to be taken from their state, district, department, or agency.

          • bttrap

            probably a v.a. hospital

    • INVENTOR INVENTED

      Republicans are cutting mental health care clinics for vets out of the budget and lying its tax reform.

      • Retired

        You better go out and re event yourself as you missed the line when they passed out brains .

    • chucky001

      Once again, “retired” shows his ignorance. Progressives put provisions in ACA to provide mandatory mental health coverage. Yet Tweety Pie wants to gut these mandates.

      • Retired

        Why don’t you and AK go choke your Chicken PERVERT .

    • Harold

      Actually, no. It is Republicans who continue to cut funding for mental health and better insurance coverage for all in order to save tax dollars for wealthy donors.

      • Retired

        You mean the Insurance lobby that funds our elected campaigns . Congress does not dictate insurance policy coverage .The Insurance Companies hire people to get out of paying for treatment and paying bills . You evidently never worked on a hospital floor .

        • Harold

          Actually that is where I worked. At a state psychiatric hospital. And I understand insurance companies do everything they can to get out of paying for mental health coverage including fighting efforts to provide mental health coverage the same as physical medicine. If they provide coverage at all, they will often limit it to 45 or 60 days and then put hospitals in the position to discharge or foot the bill. Administrators and bean counters will leverage treatment teams to discharge before people are ready resulting in much human suffering.

          • Retired

            You are in a state that gives more time than many others . Ours you are looking at less than 2 weeks stay ,plus we only have one facility for the state . Lobbyist is the downfall of the USA controlling the elected .

          • Harold

            Yes lobbyists for insurance companies that keep us from single payer. They take some much money out of health care dollars with overpaid CEOs, advertising, kickbacks, etc that we end up not providing essential care and driving up costs. Kick them to the curb except for extra care issues.

      • Retired

        Both parties are guilty for our health care system ::: Remember every time a national health care came up they used Canada as a bad example as to why not have it , but it all boils down to the Insurance Co. do not want it . Just think what would happen to investors and Pension plans the have money with Insurance Co. , it is a vicious circle that is hard to break . Just like the ACA put more into Medicaid than the actual ACA , they only tell how many sign up but never how many actually paid or stayed in the program .

        • Harold

          My wife is Canadian. There isn’t a politician anywhere in Canada, liberal or conservative, that would touch their system. It’s not perfect but it makes ours look pathetic taken as whole. We have the prenatal death rate of third world countries…

          • Retired

            How many of those deaths are due to Street drugs ???

          • Harold

            Not sure what your point is. Other countries have street drugs and those dying are someone’s child and human beings.

          • Retired

            I asked how many of those prenatal death are do to street drugs . It was not meant as a nasty ????

          • Harold

            Sorry if my response sounded like that. I didn’t mean that at all. It is sad that we lose children and adults to start drugs and I don’t know how many prenatal deaths are due to street drugs. I just think we and our health care system should be able to do better than this for both adults and children.

          • Retired

            Hey it happens ,OK . I have a big problem with combining illegal drugs with Prescription drugs . Here is why . I have RA and bin through the whole line of drugs made available and got relief from Vicodin and used them sparingly as needed and worked great . My Tricare one day said we will no longer cover it years back and the substitute was like eating pop corn and no help . In the meantime they also have taken four other drugs away and will no longer pay for them . Things have gotten worse since the ACA !!! It is time that Insurance stops dictating what DR. can do for their patients .The nightmare get worse with age and depends on where you live .

    • tCotUS

      Hey Retired…Here’s another twist to it.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwErBxw2mus

      • Rodney Steward

        This was great!! Kinda makes you sick to know our Gov. puts money and power over country and We The People and the B-TARDS are supposed to work for us! And it does seem that our gov. is one of the most corrupt in the WORLD, no wonder we hated except for our money that’s now gone!

        • tCotUS

          Kind of makes one sick doesn’t it?

          • Rodney Steward

            VERY, but I still stand by my Oath, but will never screw over our own people in any form!!

          • tCotUS

            Agreed Rodney…..Oorah

    • Scuttlebutt

      OMG—say it isn’t so????? (sarc):):):)

  • Bill O’Neil

    Dumbest headline of the day. Saying black is white makes as much sense!!!

  • gotabgood

    Texas Church Shooting is Textbook Argument Against Gun Control
    I am sure the 26 dead and 20 wounded would have a different opinion.
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e87575badd6bb2830ff20e91b8fd36f0cf57269e5380f9be4f243a5ea1c6a891.png

    • ABO

      “Should have at least done a background check on him”. They did, you idiot, and as usual the system failed. As usual you just make up stories and assume that if people hear the same lies over and over they will eventually believe your pathetic stories. Try the truth just for once in your life, or are you just not capable of it?

      • Retired

        They are blaming everything but the facts , the deranged man wanted revenge for what his life turned out to be , a failure .

        • ABO

          Oh, was it gotabamoron that did it, Retired. I thought it was Devin Kelley. Oh I see what you’re saying, what threw me off was the part about the guy being a complete failure. I assumed it must have been gotabamoron.

          • Retired

            He is also a failure , you got it right on both of them .

          • ABO

            Thanks, Retired. I call ’em as I see ’em.

          • bttrap

            and you seen right thru him

          • ABO

            I try.

          • bttrap

            that’s pretty good!!

      • gotabgood

        Do you think the system should be improved?
        You think I made up the story about Texas?

        • ABO

          You made up the story about no background check having been done. That is the lie and you know it. Yet you just spin and twist the truth in order to promote your pathetic agenda. Your modus operandi is directly out of Alinsky. Sad

          • gotabgood

            You have a queer way of looking at things… I said ..”they should have at least done a back ground check on him….”
            If they did one, it was not a very good one… and you have this dumb shitten idea I lied…. whatever they did or didn’t do… they didn’t catch the long line of crap this guy did!
            Go play with your toes..

          • ABO

            You have a queer way of passing off your lies as truth. When one says “they should have at least done a back ground check on him” when the truth is that they indeed did do a back ground check on him, no question about it, sure sounds like a lie to me. Especially considering your history of lying, twisting the truth and using half truths as fact.

          • bttrap

            you damn moron he was turned down trying to buy a gun no one knows how he got his guns or are you going to come up with another lie on how he got his guns

          • gotabgood

            I haven’t read that… maybe you would like to share your information?

          • bttrap

            you haven’t read much then quit reading those lying media papers they just hide the facts or they make up their own facts with lies

          • gotabgood

            You don’t read at all..

          • bttrap

            not those rags that you read they’re all false reporting by lying democraps

          • bttrap

            gotabegood should be gotabeliar

          • ABO

            Got that right bttrap.

        • bttrap

          you are so stupid! do you think the shooters are going to follow more laws they just laugh at you morons with your gun laws.

          • gotabgood

            Like I keep saying to you people over and over… most of the mass shootings were done by people without any criminal records. Also a lot of school shootings are done by students.
            What we have now is not working… does that mean we throw it all away or try to improve on it?
            Or just say hell with it.. the 2nd amendment gives you the right to shoot anyone at any place you decide is ok?

          • bttrap

            what we have now only hurts the honest gun owner and if we didn’t have these democrap judges like the 9th court the law might work these democrap judges just slaps their hands and let them go back on the street to kill again

      • bttrap

        he can’t handle the truth !!!!!!

        • ABO

          Don’t think he’d recognize the truth if it jumped up and bit him.

    • bttrap

      and all these shooters were either ilegals or were able to pass all your gun control laws or like the last one the law wasn’t followed as to reporting him. also all these shooters were dempcraps

      • gotabgood

        Why do you say shit like that????????????
        That is all LIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
        It is one thing to believe a lie… it is another to add to it or make it up… you are guilty of both.
        YOU ARE A LIAR
        I have no use for you….

        • bttrap

          you never could prove anything just your media lies that you think can change what a voter wants. well too bad the voters wanted a change from all the dirty politics and lies of you democraps and finally got some one to fight back at you morons with no brains

        • bttrap

          every post you made was a lie

    • mac12sam12

      Tougher gun laws don’t work because they’re directed at the people not committing the crimes. You make tougher laws on people who commit crimes with illegal weapons. They’re alway liberals.

      • gotabgood

        Most of your mass shooters… have no criminal record…. they may say weird things and do weird things…. if they arrested people for that… all the rightwingers on this blog would be gone..

  • gotabgood

    I understand now why the rightwing is ignorant of what is going on in the USA and the world.
    This is a copy of my homepage, as you can see I have different news outlets including Fox. Look closely at their headlines… these are the things they think are important to their readers…
    Even BBC wrote up something about the shootings in Texas..
    But Fox??
    You readers want to know about an orangutan (Trumps father)
    Tiger attack
    Pregnant woman in Solomon’s mines
    and a raccoon rescue
    Bravo fox…

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/529b074d75cf2e93f1a010b6e2514a8d3e34df7426a9c489e7a1c9c463556ed3.png

    • ABO

      Oh, I’m just shocked. Yet more entirely false BS from gotabamoron. I watched Fox News’ coverage from the time the story broke. Very detailed reporting including reports from the scene through Fox News affiliates in Texas as well as interviews with police officers on the scene, FBI on the scene and eyewitnesses as well as interviews with experts in the field of law enforcement. Your pathetic lies don’t wash here, clown. I watched it all and saw nothing included in your ridiculous nonsense. You are nothing but a pathetic liar. Go peddle your BS on HuffPo or Media Matters where you’ll find plenty of ill informed dimwits that will buy every word of it, hook, line and sinker.

      • Retired

        He just another deranged idiot like AK spewing only hate .

      • gotabgood

        Lie??? BS???? I gave you a copy of my webpage that shows headlines of each news outlet…and you call me a liar???? How can that be a lie??
        Do you know what the word liar means????

        • ABO

          Oh, my how could I have missed that??? How could I possibly doubt the webpage content of The Great and glorious gotabamoron??? “How can that be a lie”??? Over time you have proved yourself to be tremendously dishonest and deceitful. absolutely comfortable with fabricating the disinformation you pass off as fact, but I should simply accept your fabrications as unarguable truth??? BS is what you spread. Liar is what you are.

          • gotabgood

            Oh Lord no.. I do not expect you or anyone to accept my word for anything… that is why I give you references… and then from there you can do some more searching.
            It would be nice if you fine people here on this site would start giving references. A coupe have.. and I get references to Joe the Plumber, many blogs… not much in form of a news outlet… unless you count National Enquirer as a news outlet.
            And for your final couple of sentences… for someone that think their opinions mount to anything more than what you would find at the bottom of a cesspool, you have no room to talk about any body that tries to enlighten you from your dark dungeon of stupidity.

          • ABO

            As I stated initially I watched the Fox News broadcast from the time the first reports came in and what you claim they covered during that time is BS, nothing more, nothing less. Pure, unadulterated BS. As far as your incredibly egocentric rant (last paragraph) Booker T. Washington once said “Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of stupidity. I think you would do well to read that quote over and over until it sinks in, although I believe that you are likely far too self absorbed to learn anything from those words.

          • gotabgood

            We keep going back over the same thing.. I said nothing except what was written on my webpage through different news outlets. I sent you a photo copy of my webpage. so you wouldn’t think I was making it up!!!
            But I’ll be damn if you didn’t accuse me of being dishonest, spreading BS and called me a LIAR!!!
            FOR WHAT, SHOWING YOU MY WEB PAGE???
            And you think I need help!!

          • ABO

            What part of “I watched the Fox News broadcast” do you not understand. I WATCHED IT Nothing that you claim were the headlines covered during that time period appeared on my screen. NONE OF IT!!!!! I could not possibly care less what is on your webpage! Get it??? It was not presented on Fox News when you claim it was. NOT A WORD OF IT. And yes I do think you need help. Seems pretty obvious.

          • gotabgood

            Again… I do not give a flipping rolling donut what you did or did not watch….
            I WAS TALKING ABOUT WHAT WAS ON MY WEBPAGE

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/529b074d75cf2e93f1a010b6e2514a8d3e34df7426a9c489e7a1c9c463556ed3.png

          • ABO

            What you said was that you downloaded the material you show here to your webpage and what is contained is what each network covered on that day which is BS. As I said repeatedly I watched Fox News all day and did not see anything that even remotely resembled what you show as what Fox presented. You are absolutely as thick as a brick and then some.

          • bttrap

            your references don’t count because they probably came out of a comic book

          • bttrap

            you are so right

        • bttrap

          it means democrap!!!

    • bttrap

      craw back under your rock. If you don’t have toliet paper use what you have posted here it should last you a year

  • tCotUS

    Devin Kelley’s Facebook page stated that he was an atheist and his interests included “Civil and social rights” and “Civil rights” as well as endorsements for local Texan Democratic political candidates. His page also featured photos of several high powered weapons.
    Odd isn’t it? His Facebook page was taken down without explanation less than an hour after the shooting.
    Devin does not belong Antifa ? So why is the FBI so busy scrubbing his records ?
    Of course this is just a coincidence I’m sure. Oh one other thing, if you Google the shooters name on google why does it “autocompletes antifa conspiracy”? Always someone who wanting to steer America in the wrong direction. Trust noone, always do your own research.

  • Tiger

    Any massacre, of which we have had many since 9/11, most perpetrated by Muslims and I am sure, the Ult Left wanted this man to be a Christian and a soldier with PTSD, is a loud cry for all of us to carry. They must be sorely disappointed. But I have a serious problem with a man who supposedly was having family problems, going to a church and killing people he didn’t know, when his mother-in-law not even there. Usually these kinds of men, kill their kin, they have stand offs with the police for killing their kin, they don’t go into a church and slaughter innocents.

    Just like the Vegas killer we don’t get the skinny anymore, we get what ever kind of baloney they want to tell us to keep us down. I mean can you imagine if the first reports that came out on YouTube showing this man’s Facebook page as having an antifascist flag on it, were true, is it? I don’t know. I mean Antifa had said November 4th was to be the beginning of the overthrow of Trump, this happened the next day, the man had a weapon in the picture also. That wouldn’t fare well for the Democrats now would it. I mean Hillary still calling for “Resistance”, resistance to Trump, then Obama with his organization and 30,000, Soros and his paid rioters, BLM and what they have done prior and after, the man who shot up the Republican baseball field, the guy who shot his Republican neighbor etc. Just wouldn’t look good for them and their screaming for violence.

    Who the Hell knows anymore? All I know is sadly this man did that then tried to run away, stopped by a man with a gun. That is what we need to focus on. The Democrats might as well give it up, it does not compute to disarm citizens while these maniacs have guns. What kind of thinking is that? Every time Obama speaks out about guns sells go sky high. I want Obama’s security, along with every Democrat and every Hollywood blood sucker disarmed, now, right now.

    http://fortune.com/2017/11/06/youtube-statement-search-results-texas-shooting/

    • pappy450

      Just like the SUPPOSED “Vegas killer” (that I CALL a “false flag” GOVERNMENT OPERATION) Let the “cover-ups” begin. All I got from this, was a GOOD GUY with HIS GUN, stopping a mentally deranged BAD GUY that did the “shooting”, BUT all the DEMOCOMMIES/RINOS see is another “opening” to call for more “gun control” and disarmament of LAW-ABIDING Citizens (as usual). Even if there was a TRUCK involved (like in N.Y. city) Seems THAT is the only “talking point” these parrots are capable of.

      • Tiger

        Won’t happen, how can they use a shooting where a gun actually stopped the murderer to put forward their banner? Lunacy.

        • Retired

          The only way it will not happen is to dump the UN and people like Clintons and Obama who were their Puppets . It is time to think of the USA first and not the rest of the world first .

          • Tiger

            Retired, where ya been, Trump flayed the UN, his speech tore them a new one and he was all about Sovereignty. Trump ran on America first, he is putting us first. Buck up over there things are going good.

          • Retired

            If we could only get Congress on the same page , but that would be stepping on the market boys and the Bilderberg Group along with the OWO .

          • Tiger

            Well they are being herded into the corral like bulls who don’t wanna. They either follow or they fall. I prefer the latter.

          • Retired

            We can help them fail by voting them out , starting with School boards to WDC .

          • Tiger

            Amen

          • Mark Clemens

            If our House is not in order. How can we help our neighbors?

          • Tiger
        • pappy450

          Exactly …Doesn’t fit the democommie “narrative” to further their push for complete disarmament of LAW ABIDING CITIZENS. (for easy takeover) I also see on the LIBERAL channels here in N.Y. State, they are STILL calling this semi-auto rifle an “assault weapon” (as usual) I have tried to write and INFORM these liberal idiots this rifle was NOT a select-fire weapon capable of full auto fire.

          • Tiger

            Well I tell ya my friend I ain’t telling nobody what we have or anything. Cause if and when Islam gets feisty out here, they will find out.

          • pappy450

            Tiger,
            You an I both..Put it THIS way..I don’t NEED a “full auto” rifle to accomplish what I need to do if someone kicks in MY door.

          • Tiger

            You got it. There are also such things as places where nobody even thinks to look. Every home should have a hidden place that family can go if and when trouble arrives. Or a plan with a place.

          • pappy450

            How about a cabin situated on the back of 9000 acres? THAT is my “escape plan”.

          • Tiger

            I like an underground bunker but we don’t have one.

          • pappy450

            The little fat demented retard in North Korea keeps it up and we probably won’t have anywhere to hide anyhow.

          • Tiger

            Well soon as he pulls a nuke out you know he wont have time to hide before his country a glass factory.

          • Retired

            The Democrats would rather throw more money at him . It will be interesting how Xi and Trump meeting goes .China is the only one that can tame Kim Boy .

          • Tiger
          • pappy450

            I believe he had better think twice before pulling anything. If he THINKS for a minute that what he is actually SEEING is “all there is” he is sadly mistaken. We DO have nuclear subs armed to the teeth, and more than likely parked just off the coast. AND bombers equipped with nukes that are now on 24 hour alert status. (and a REAL COMMANDER IN CHIEF that WILL use these if PROVOKED) No more Mr. “nice guy” milquetoast OSCUMBAG to ‘barter” with.

          • Tiger

            Exactly. So many say well he is so arrogant that he wants to keep his lifestyle and live, others say no he is so fanatic he doesn’t care and will do it. I am reading a book, “The Aquariums of Pyongyang.” Ten years in the North Korean Gulag. Bush interviewed this man. In this book one learns about Kin’s father and how the people dreaded when Kim came into power and they said, he would be a nuclear danger to the world. So he is.

            There are countries who should not be allowed to be part of the UN or any world body. N. Korea, Iran, Turkey and many others. I have to laugh how the Ult Left who always spoke with Russia, due to their Mantra of Trump/Russian Collusion, which is failing and falling apart, they will most likely see total red when Trump speaks to Putin. But it is OK with them for him to talk to killers all over the world.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dF47rrHd7wo

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szEdEh9ysM0

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNjae521qa8

    • John Williams

      Hello Tiger, consider, it is the left and their minions who always demand that only law enforcement and the military have guns. When you listen to them, it is the left who also claims that it is law enforcement who shoot too often and too fast, but they still want the very people who they blame for being too quick on the trigger, to have the guns. Proof once again that “liberal logic” is an oxymoron. These fools must have terrible headaches from all of this stupidity.

      • Tiger

        Hi John I hope they keep it up, cause the more danger for us the more guns will sell.

        • curmudgeon VN Veteran

          Today I swung my front door wide open and placed my Remington 12ga semi-auto shotgun right in the doorway. I left 9 shells beside it, then left it alone and went about my business. While I was gone, the mailman delivered my mail, the neighbor boy across the street mowed the yard, a girl walked her dog down the street, and quite a few cars stopped at the stop sign near the front of my house. After about an hour, I checked on the gun. It was still sitting there, right where I had left it. It hadn’t moved itself. It certainly hadn’t killed anyone, even with the numerous opportunities it had presented to do so. In fact, it hadn’t even loaded itself.

          Well you can imagine my surprise, with all the hype by the Left and the Media about how dangerous guns are and how they kill people. Either the media is wrong, or I’m in possession of the laziest gun in the world.

          The United States is third in Murders throughout the World. But if you take out just four cities: Chicago, Detroit, Washington, DC and New Orleans, the United States is fourth from the bottom, in the entire world, for Murders! These four Cities also have the toughest Gun Control Laws in the U. S. All four of these cities are controlled by Democrats. It would be absurd to draw any conclusions from this data – right?

          Well, I’m off to check on my spoons. I hear they’re making people fat.

          • Tiger

            LOLOLOL there was a site, wish I could find it where a guy put a gun fully loaded on a table, kept daily track of it to see when it was going to kill someone.

          • curmudgeon VN Veteran

            I vaguely recall it. I’ll look for it.

    • Retired

      We see the Obama type on all these web pages spewing their hate because Hillary lost .

      • Tiger

        I am surprised that the riots have calmed down, Antifa failed in getting people from all over like they did before and BLM has calmed down. I wonder if their leaders finally understand this isn’t the way to do things and they are killing their own party?

        • Retired

          Their sneaky King Obama is still trying , plus the weather is getting colder in the northern half so they go hide until it warms up again . They will be out in full force next year for the mid term elections .

          • Tiger

            Oh I hope so, that would really put the kabash on them.

    • William Burke

      It did have atheist links all over it. This man was being eaten alive by all the hatred and resentment inside him because he blamed other people for all his problems, even the ones that were obviously his and his alone. His Hell wasn’t other people; it was himself.

      Like most such people, his murder-suicides came in the exact wrong order; he should have killed himself first, not last.

    • curmudgeon VN Veteran

      Why Grandpa carries a gun

      · The quintessential reason why Grandpa carries a gun.

      · Please take time to read this and pay particular attention to “A Little Gun History” about half way down – staggering numbers!

      Why Carry a Gun?

      My old Grandpa said to me, ‘Son, there comes a time in every man’s life when he stops bustin’ knuckles and starts bustin’ caps and usually it’s when he becomes too old to take a whoopin’.’

      I don’t carry a gun to kill people; I carry a gun to keep from being killed.

      I don’t carry a gun because I’m evil; I carry a gun because I have lived long enough to see the evil in the World.

      I don’t carry a gun because I hate the government; I carry a gun because I understand the limitations of government.

      I don’t carry a gun because I’m angry; I carry a gun so that I don’t have to spend the rest of my life hating myself for failing to be prepared.

      I don’t carry a gun because I want to shoot someone; I carry a gun because I want to die at a ripe old age in my bed and not on a sidewalk somewhere tomorrow afternoon.

      I don’t carry a gun to make me feel like a man; I carry a gun because men know how to take care of themselves and the ones they love.

      I don’t carry a gun because I feel inadequate; I carry a gun because unarmed and facing three armed thugs, I am inadequate.

      I don’t carry a gun because I love it; I carry a gun because I love life and the people who make it meaningful to me.

      Police protection is an oxymoron: Free citizens must protect themselves because police cannot protect you from crime; they investigate the crime after it happens and then call someone in to clean up the mess.

      Personally, I carry a gun because I’m too young to die and too old to take a whoopin’!

      A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

      · PLEASE DON’T THINK FOR A MOMENT, THAT THIS COULDN’T HAPPEN IN OUR COUNTRY ALSO !!!!!!

      · In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control:

      · From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      In 1911, Turkey established gun control:

      · From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      Germany established gun control in 1938:

      · From 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      China established gun control in 1935:

      · From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      Guatemala established gun control in 1964:

      · From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      Uganda established gun control in 1970:

      · From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      Cambodia established gun control in 1956:

      · From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

      ———————–

      56 million defenseless people were rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control.

      ———————–

      You won’t see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.

      · Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.

      With guns, we are ‘citizens’; without them, we are ‘subjects’.

      During WW II, the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!

      · Gun owners in the USA are the largest armed forces in the World!

      · If you value your freedom, please spread this anti-gun control message to all of your friends.

      · The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense.

      · The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either.

      · SWITZERLANDISSUES A GUN TO EVERY HOUSEHOLD! SWITZERLAND ‘S GOVERNMENT ISSUES AND TRAINS EVERY ADULT IN THE USE OF A RIFLE.

      · SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!

      · IT’S A NO BRAINER! DON’T LET OUR GOVERNMENT WASTE MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET.

      ·

      I’m a firm believer in the 2nd Amendment! If you are too, please forward this.

      If you’re not a believer, please reconsider the true facts. This is history; not what’s being shown on TV, sanctioned by our illustrious delusional leaders in Washington.

      • Tiger

        Excellent and everyone needs to see this. Needs to go viral. Needs to be up on every bodies kitchen wall as a constant reminder. Then we have this by another poster.

        BonLovesFreedom • 2 days ago

        Our 2nd Amendment helps us not to ‘fear’ followers of islame, but to be prepared instead.
        Abolish “Gun-Free Zones” – they make America much more dangerous.
        At
        least 145 people killed by terrorists, or terrorist-types, in 6 days of
        November, 2017, including 12 police, military or security forces.
        11/6 Afghanistan-Consulate employee gunned down outside his home in Jalalabad by motorcyclists
        11/6 Syria-Explosion in Deir ez-Zor injured 9; 4 Russian journalists & 5 Russian servicemen (isis)
        11/5 Syria-Children among 100 displaced civilians slaughtered by suicide car bomber in Deir ez-Zor, 140 others wounded (isis)
        11/5 Yemen-Suicide car bomber & shooting at government building; 17 people killed, 30 injured in Aden (isis)
        11/5 Iraq-Security personnel among 6 people killed in Mosul by gunmen & bomb blasts, 6 hurt (isis)
        11/5 Iraq-Suicide bombers targeted a mosque in Kirkuk; 5 worshipers dead, 20 others hurt
        11/5 Cameroon-3 innocent people brutally slain in Mahoula (boko haram)
        11/5 Iraq-Bomb in Baghdad shopping center claimed 2 lives, wounded 9 people
        11/5 Ingushetia-Young police officer gunned down in Yandare, 2 others injured (isis)
        11/5 Afghanistan-A passerby was torn apart by bomb in Jalgaldi (taliban)
        11/5 Pakistan-Landmine in South Waziristan disintegrates a child, 2 others hurt (taliban)
        11/5 Iraq-Bomb targeting a family in Shalalat killed a child, 6 other people wounded (isis)
        11/5 Iraq-A boy was blown to pieces by bomb blast in Tal al-Samn
        11/4 Iraq-3 children killed by shrapnel while playing in a garden in Qubba (al-qaeda)
        11/4 Syria-Mortar shells hit Damascus neighborhood; 2 people dead, 10 wounded (tahrir al-sham)
        11/4 India-Attacks in Rajpora left 1 person dead, 2 others injured
        11/4 Iraq-Army commander killed & 4 soldiers injured by bomb blast in Anbar (isis)
        11/3
        Syria-Suicide car bomber exterminated 9 residents of neighborhood in
        Hader, Quneitra Governorate, 23 wounded (tahrir al-sham; formerly
        jabhat al-nusra)
        11/3 Nigeria-6 villagers of Jaddannam murdered, livestock stolen & homes burned (boko haram)
        11/3 Iraq-3 police officers lost their lives to brutal attack in Udhaim, 3 others hurt (isis)
        11/2 India-A political activist in Kiloora kidnapped, tortured, then his throat slit (isis)
        11/2 Tunisia-A pastor was injured by planted bomb blast in Kasserine (isis)
        11/1 Afghanistan-15 people killed, 27 hurt by explosion near 2 tankers & a bus in Charikar (taliban)
        11/1 Iraq-Explosions of bombs in western Mosul homes left 9 people dead (isis)
        11/1 Afghanistan-Sticky bomb triggers fire in Parwan; incinerated 8 people, 27 more wounded
        11/1 Iraq-Family of 6 in Mosul obliterated by shrapnel (isis)
        11/1 Cameroon-Suicide bombing at mosque in Mayo-Tsanaga killed 6, injured 2 (boko haram)
        11/1 Iraq-3 people in their Rutba home killed by bomb blast (isis)
        11/1 Pakistan-While guarding a vaccination drive in Charsadda, 2 police killed, 1 hurt
        11/1 Afghanistan-Suicide bomber in Balkh killed 1 person, injured 9 others
        11/1 Tunisia-2 policemen in Tunis near parliament stabbed; 1 dead, 1 wounded (1 male terrorist)
        11/1 Pakistan-Young woman honor killed by brother for suspected ‘immoral’ activity in Satto Katla

  • Sen. Durbin is so stupid he doesn’t even understand what is happening in his own state…. Chicago with the toughest gun control in the nation and the highest gun violence… People who wants to kill will kill with whatever they can get their hands on… Guns don’t kill, people kill with cars and trucks are we to ban cars and trucks also? People kill with knives are we to ban all knives?

    • bttrap

      durbin is old and should retire he has no idea of what’s going on in his own state and probably dosen’t care as long as he gets his payoffs. durbin and the mayor of chicago needs to get out and let some one that cares take over

  • countybull

    My wife and I send our prayers to the Texas Church members. We enjoy Turkey and Pheasant
    season. I don’t see how anyone could enjoy shooting up a Church full
    of people on a Sunday morning! We were not raised that way!

    Jess Estes

    • Linda Pears

      Amen Jess,

  • John Williams

    What we see from the last 2 shootings, the failure of gun control laws, Texas, (a person with a domestic violence charge is NOT allowed to own a gun) but he had one anyway because the system of laws failed to protect, the Air Force has admitted THEY failed to file the paperwork that would have denied the shooter access to guns, yet the anti-gun weenies scream for more laws that will only affect LAW ABIDING citizens. Vegas, (the shooter passed every background check, you know the background checks the left always demands, but are already the law). The leftist/socialist/democrats have an agenda, that agenda is total disarmament of LAW ABIDING CITIZENS, while leaving the criminal element to run free and depriving the rest of us the ability to defend ourselves. Imagine the result of what the left wants, in the Texas situation, NO LAW ABIDING CITIZEN WITH A GUN TO STEP IN, leaving the shooter to do anything he wanted, like it or not the fact is a good guy with a gun was able to stop a bad guy with a gun. Much is made by the left about the number of people killed with guns each year, I agree, truly a tragedy, but put it into perspective and the numbers are very low compared to total population, the number of actual guns available and the removal of the number of deaths in, say the top three cities with the highest numbers, like Chicago. There are probably 100s of millions of guns in this country, the number actually used for nefarious purposes, is minuscule, the rest belong to law abiding citizens.

  • BeachN

    And RIGHT ON QUE I might add. “Stephen King: “How many more have to die before we enact sane gun control laws?” Yes indeed. Brought to you by your local Homeland Security Agency with the backup of shadow government. Continue to fall for the BS if you choose but I have had enough of the lies.

    • pappy450

      You will NEVER get the truth, because the democommies/rinos POLITICIANS want everyone to be disarmed for easy takeover as it has been in decades past in other countries. All one has to do is find a REAL history book to read all about it. Children today will NEVER get a chance to read it, because our school books have been re-written by liberal “progressive” communists for easy indoctrination of students by communist “teachers and “professors” that poison their minds with their LIES.

  • disqus_htVNWSBEmM

    Anyone notice that none of the mass murderers belong to the N.R.A? None them are Republicans.
    The guy that stopped him him from killing others had been an instructor for the N.R.A. What if he were prohibited from owning a gun…who would have come to the rescued of the survivors? The anti- gunners never give that thought serious consideration. The 2nd amendment is for self defense.
    Never give up your guns or vote for anyone is against guns. Criminals will ALWAYS have guns .
    People who are too dumb think otherwise are too stupid to have authority.

  • Who cares what liberal Hollywood thinks.
    Hollywood was Hollywood when John Wayne and others were stars.
    These people arent stars with their political agenda being paid to use their so called platform to tell us what to do.
    Stop your security guards and electrical fences and armed escorts and then talk to me.
    Shut up mouth pieces in slimewood!!

  • Donald Lindsey

    Liberal Democrats jump to push their anti-gun agenda against we the people of America, but have you ever hears them say anything about stopping Crime or the Illegals or Terrorists from entering this Country? Neither have I but I have heard them state our boarders should remain open, that the only thing to fear is fear itself. We should not fear Islamic beliefs for they are kind people that mean no harm to anyone, that were really proven during the attack on America on 9/11 with men, women, children and babies brutally murdered by Cowards.

    Socialistic Democrats wants the people of America disarmed but the criminals, rapists, murderers and Terrorists that are now in this Country thanks to the democrats and Obama’s violation of the our Constitution and Laws. Yes we the true people of America who pays their lying salaries blame the leftist liberal democrats who has set out to turn America into another manure third world country of disgrace and dishonor for they the democrats do not know what it is to have Honor.

  • SFC Paul Karpinski U.S.Army Re

    Just one thing take honest citizens guns. Then only the criminals will have guns!!!!!

    • Valor

      Only the criminals and the GOVERNMENT! Think about it! That is the REAL purpose of gun control.

  • Valor

    Several points need to be made here. Gun control laws are not and never have been about public safety. Gun control laws are and always have been about the safety of those in power who wish to increase and protect their power from the people. The 2nd Amendment’s purpose is a last line of defense against the tyranny of government the framers of the Constitution knew would eventually suppress liberty. The first serious gun control laws appeared shortly after the Civil War as part of the Jim Crow Laws implemented by entrenched southern Demorat politicians to protect their power from potential threats by recently freed slaves. Since that time gun control laws have been used to limit political power of one segment of society or another. Now that the Leftist/Demorat Party has almost reached its long term goal of permanent single party government ruled by a select elite it is mandatory to disarm the free citizens. There are two factors here. One, an unarmed society is easier to control and rule. Two, by denying citizens the right to self defense the people have to turn to government for at least the hope of protection. This not only increases the power of government, it increases the power and job security of self serving politicians. However, the real issue here is NOT guns! The real issue is whether the Constitution and Bill of Rights are still relevant. If one supposedly protected liberty can be legislated away so can and so WILL the rest. There are already calls for restrictions on free speech. There are already policies that limit the free exercise of religion. There already violations of 4th Amendment protections. When the 2nd Amendment is rendered impotent the rest of those God given liberties will quickly follow.

  • jimdarnall

    Oh yes, we better get laws to keep killers from renting or owning trucks that kill people. It’s the person not the tool that kills. Why cant liberals see the truth?

    • Valor

      Truth and liberalism is like oil and water. They don’t mix!!

      • Retired

        Yo bad they don’t drown themselves in either one of them . We can light the oil and give them a warm send off.

    • bttrap

      their heads are stuck in their butts so they can’t see anything

  • daveveselenak

    I find it quite puzzling that this crazy unemployed dead-beat was able to amass that expensive, small arsenal OR were we just led to believe this by the Dark State propagandists; I choose the latter, I contend that it was arranged for gun control agenda but that’s just the cynical me!

    • bttrap

      I also agree with you those democraps will do anything

  • will

    On Sat a illegal alien Rolando Martinez sniper shot 4 people on I35 in Texas hitting one little girl in the face now in critical condition. Nothing on the news and several days before being on line. WHY?
    If you saw on the news how many illegal aliens kill everyday in this country you might be shocked. 15 people are victims of illegal aliens everyday.. In 2015 there were 60,000 alien violent criminals in our prisons

  • Donno

    Anyone who listens to Chelsea Handler needs their heads examined. She, self admittedly, screwed her way to the top. She has no morals or scruples or brains and yet she offers her far left wing opinion to everyone and some left wing libertards actually listen to her. If Handler is considered any sort of spokeswoman for my cause I would hide in a barn. Do any libs use their heads instead of emotions?

  • Rodney Steward

    These sick FOOLS don’t realize if we ever have gun control, this country as we know it will never be the same again and these same fools will pay like the rest of America, no one will be safe, bad guys and crazy muslims running wild, crime will grow by 70% and all is lost, just like all of Europe! But this is the goal of the Globalist that really think they can have this sick twisted dream they have for mankind, and little do they know that dream will never happen no matter what they do!! We still have the safest country in the world!! D’N the Dem. socialist party!!

    • Simply_Sis

      That is why they’re referred to as ‘useful idiots’ (google it).

      • Rodney Steward

        I sure will my friend!!

  • tony

    IM GLAD I LIVE IN FL!!!!!!!!!!A RIGHT TO CARRY STATE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Rodney Steward

      Same here in AL!!!!!!!!!A !!!! 🙂 And stand your ground!

  • CrustyOldGeezer

    COMMON SENSE GUN CONTROL LAWS (Why yes, Virginia, they do exist.)

    The only NEW GUN LAW that America really needs, and we REALLY DO NEED this one.

    K-12 MANDATORY Firearm Safety.

    Beginning in Kindergarten, and continuing through school K-12 I suggest a MANDATORY firearms education class.

    Complete with hands on training and live fire from 4th grade on. The older the student, the larger the caliber.

    With a full and complete knowledge of firearms, what their uses are, and the inherent dangers being well known the number of ‘accidents’ will plummet.

    MANDATORY to ensure that ALL AMERICANS know how to safely handle firearms.

    With the intimate knowledge of safe firearms usage, more people will be likely to carry, either concealed or open.
    “opting out” is NOT an option. They do not have to have firearms in their homes, but EVERYBODY needs to know safe practices.

    It will become the norm, and with a certain knowledge that there will be return fire, the loons that want to shoot up a school for their instant glory in the spotlight of the current news cycle will no longer
    view schools, movie theaters and shopping malls as a great place to become famous.

    To counter the gun control nuts gnashing of teeth and wailing incessantly, I propose the following:

    Automobiles kill and maim far more people each year than firearms.. AND they offer minimal training in schools.. usually 6 weeks or less.

    In woodshop, the students are taught the dangers of all the power tools, as well as the hand tools, and the safe usage and handling.
    Metal working shop, same thing. Dangers and hazards are demonstrated and explained.

    The student are taught safety and proper handling procedures.

    sexual activity has hazards and inherent dangers, and the school system has taken on the task of educating the children in safe practices.
    (usually against the parents wishes)

    The list can go on for a very long time.

    The end result is, EDUCATION is the only safe route to minimal firearms accidents, and the gun control lobby is the sole obstacle to keeping Americans of all ages safe from the misuse of firearms.

    They insist that all people, when they see a gun, run away and hide, shrieking with fear all the while.

    They don’t teach the same behavior about cars…. or power tools, or condoms, or lawn mowers, or swimming pools…

    End result is more people knowing , and UNDERSTANDING the Second Amendment.
    After graduation more people will be carrying open and concealed.
    The criminal element will disappear further into the shadows facing odds they do not like.

    The Military gets pre-trained marksmen and sharpshooters.
    Corrupt politicians no longer have control over the People.

  • tCotUS
  • Wolffx Pookie

    It’s not a gun problem..The problem is one on the social side.. No one values life anymore.. People have been to far extreme left or the extreme right.. What the hell happened to compassion for your fellow man or woman. To help one another.. All the shootings are a social problem. Teach your children well. Education is the key to preventing violence. Write as many laws as you want against guns and it won’t change a thing..

  • 6X6

    First his Discharge was a “Less Than Honorable Discharge” This discharge along with his Domestic Violence Convictions. Unfortunately these were the reasons for his discharge. Then according to statute and law the Air Force should have reported him to the FBI and the NCIC Computer. So along with this evil freak, the U.S. Air Force has earned considerable dirt on their parade. I am an Air Force Veteran and am ashamed that they failed and indeed ALLOWED this event to take place.

  • Simply_Sis

    The liberal’s motto: Do as I say, not as I do.

    Liberals like to moralize, and they’re the LAST people who should. Their moral compass is distorted. Many rich and famous liberals have armed body guards and live in fortresses, while at the same time telling Americans to give up their guns. The actors and actresses who play in violent movies and played characters who use guns will vehemently and dramatically weigh in on gun control, like Julianne Moore. They love lecturing us and the pats on the back they get from from their esteemed colleagues and the press they get from the MSM, that they don’t seem aware of the hypocrisy they’re engaged in. They a deluded bunch.

  • Donald E. Pruett

    WHERE IS THE INFORMATION ABOUT THESE CRAZY SHOOTERS’ POLITICAL BACKGROUND OR THEIR PARENT’S POLITICAL IDOLOGY???? I get the feeling that the rank and file news media won’t want to disclose this information because it just may not fit their liberal agenda. What is the Columbine shooter’s political party background? How about that crazy guy in Tucson who shot Gabby Gifford? What is his political home life like? Same for the Las Vegas shooter and now this one in Texas. We know how “Left” that crazy Democrat shooter in Washington D.C was who shot the baseball playing politicians. I have a sneaky feeling that if these guys were Republicans and/or members of the NRA the crazy Left would be all over this like a rash. Again, if its true that they all have Leftist leanings they will go to any length to keep it hushed. I’ll bet there are a few million Democrats who own guns. I wonder if they’ll give up theirs. Would they SELL them to someone else or take the loss and have them melted down and guarantee those guns would never hurt anyone? Do they walk it like they talk it?

  • Donald E. Pruett

    A Japanese officer is reported to have said prior to Pearl Harbor: “We could never invade America. There’s a gun behind every bush.”

  • Glenda Hammer

    When guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns.

  • Jon’s On

    The democrats agenda is to control everyone else. They follow Saul Alinsky’s book “Rules for Radicals” to a tee. One thing in that book is “never let a crisis go to waste”. And they don’t. This shooter shouldn’t have been able to purchase a firearm but it looks like the Air Force screwed up and didn’t report him to the FBI database. Thank god there was a good guy with a gun close by or this would have been way worse. Maybe we should have gun control. The democrats and commies can’t get a gun but the rest of us not mentally ill people can.

    • gotabgood

      And whether you believe it or not… you are following Hitler’s agenda.
      WHO TRUMP IDOLIZES
      Our new friends? Our new roll models?
      Donald Trump praises ‘maniac’ North Korea dictator Kim Jong un for strong leadership
      >
      ‘At least he’s a leader!’ Trump’s extraordinary verdict on Vladimir Putin after he is asked if he should take support from ‘a person who kills journalists’
      >
      As for Syrian president Bashar al Assad, Trump said that “maybe he’s better than the kind of people we’re supposed to be backing.”
      >
      AND DOES THIS SURPRISE ANYONE??
      >
      Donald Trump’s ex wife once said Trump kept a book of Hitler’s speeches by his bed
      >
      Donald Trump=s ex wife Ivana related in a 1990 interview with Vanity Fair that Afrom time to time her husband reads a book of Hitler=s collected speeches, My New Order, which he keeps in a cabinet by his bed.@ Trump confirmed that the former Mrs. Trump=s 1990 assertion is true.
      The Hitler volume, AMy New Order@ not only contains 23 years= worth of Hitler=s speeches, Ait is profusely indexed and filled with details about the speeches= impact on the media and the political establishment.@ According to a literary periodical, Kirkus Review, Trump=s collection of Hitler speeches contains Aactual quotations from Hitler=s own utterances, including corresponding data showing the effect on the world press. Section after section follows pattern background, speech, press;@ and Donald Trump faithfully follows Hitler=s model.

      >
      THIS IS YOUR MAN???? THINK…. PLEASE..

      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/3d28b35a03eaeaa72f7c7cfe7346251355451d71ca51d0aad865f80eba0d929d.jpg

    • gotabgood

      This good guy with a gun…. he showed up after the shooting.. the damage was done…

      • Maybe all preachers and pastors should start packing? What I have noticed is it’s usually a black shooter that goes into a white church, or a white shooter that goes into a black Christian church to do their shooting.
        The damage may have been done, but the shooter is D E A D no lawyer is going get him out of his obligation now!

        • gotabgood

          ” What I have noticed is it’s usually a black shooter that goes into a white church, or a white shooter that goes into a black Christian church to do their shooting.”
          I thought the shooter was white and the church was majority white….

          As for him being dead.. I have no problem with that… Although it would be nice to question these lunatics and see what set them off. put him in a cell, give him a computer and make him think he is on the internet, but in reality to a server in the building, to see what he has to say and to whom..

  • dick yocum

    Gee I thought this was evidence for national open carry. We have a right to protect ourselves when others cannot protect us

  • BILL

    That is the same thing I said. The beauracracy screwed up. We don’t need more laws. Use the ones we have!

  • CUZIN ERN

    In Shy town we could care less about gun regs or any thing else about GUNS as we want to keep taking shooting lessons on how to kill,our competitors!

  • Roger

    You have the most strict gun laws in Chicago. The wounded and death rate in Chicago in one year is higher then all mass shootings this year. Since 9/11 Chicago has more people murdered there then all the lives lost in the twin towers. Stricter gun laws, Their nuts. The only gun control these leftist idiots need is a bullet to the head and rid this country of all it’s ignorance. Make all these rich idiots wanting gun control, have the guns taken away from their body guards first.

  • Roger

    Also what we need is more mass shootings of the hollywood deletes and dumbocratic politicians. That would make everybody’s day. Literally ignorance shot down.

  • jcgreen2

    Having the God-given, fundamental, natural, unalienable, constitutionally-protected right to keep and bear arms, means we will have some wacko shootings occasionally. That’s just something we’ll have to live with. BUT… if more good people were armed, we could mitigate the damage these sick people inflict on us. Several members of that Texas congregation should have been armed and able to dispatch the shooter to Hell immediately. The ONLY thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun!

  • kv2109

    Funny, the politicans and hollyweirdos all have bodyguards and live in glass houses in gated communities; so they’re protected 24/7…

  • Charles Wolfe jr

    NO NEW GUN LAWS !!!!!!!!

  • Alleged-Comment

    Again, this kind of argument is the DUMBEST thing around.

    EVERY one should know by now if you disarm the population by LAW then only LAW ABIDERS will disarm.

    The criminal (because of his obvious nature) will then be the one ARMED (since he does not obey any law and why he is called a criminal in the first place) and he will be the WORSE character to have a gun. The VERY REASON why you are seeking disarnament.

    So this GUN CONTROL sh it can never be accepted by our society, which is proven by being the FREEST country in the world!!! The greatest in the world and has NEVER been invaded.

    Only criminal and communist want you disarmed. Which, by the way, are the two greatest SNEAKY THIEVES EVER devised of mankind.

    One likes to steal your property by thievery, the other by treachery. And, believe you me, they both do it because they have the GUNS!!!

  • off the hook

    Sociopaths and Outlaws do not obey laws, no matter how many laws the socialist liberals will waste time and treasure on !!!

  • tCotUS

    I really do not believe these shooting will stop. We should be looking at every possible angle.
    Why was it not known he was in the mental ward? How & who helped him get out, arranged weapons,
    interfered with his history?? Ask Questions, Demand answers… This is a link of part two..
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwErBxw2mus

  • Cejs99

    When do we stop blaming the other guy. These problems need the help of both sides of the fence. We cannot stop these horrific acts without the help of both Republicans or Democrats. Please work together to help minimize these events.

  • rockyndallas

    If guns were the problem, a gun show would be a very dangerous place. In fact the opposite is true. Excepting criminals and ‘progressives’ (apologies for the redundancy), the vast majority of gun owners are lawful and peaceful, wanting only the ability to defend themselves if confronted by evil.

  • MTnman

    It would minimize problems if the judges, lawyers and bureaucrats, allowing the release of dangerous criminals back into our midst, would be forced to serve the sentences and pay the fines of the accused for the damage caused to individuals and society.

  • marius aubert

    You are correct Lynne, but I have spoken to mac12 before and he believes wholeheartedly that tax cuts will yield 4 to 6% growth which is ridiculous. Even in the Trump administration they are touting the need to get to 3% growth regularly. Tax cuts will as they always have done yield a brief increase in the rate of growth in this country, but they will blow an even bigger whole in our deficit while funneling money to the wealthiest of Americans. They will not produce any lasting effect. they have never before in our country and they did not in Kansas so they will not this time either.

  • Bob C

    The only reason someone was able to shoot the Texas Church gunman was because, it is said, he ran out of ammo and the clip was empty. Otherwise, he could have killed another 26 people. WEAPON OF MASS DESTRUCTION, folks!!!

  • J.B.Jacobs

    You will notice most of the shootings take place where the shooter knows there are no guns, like the churches. If he thought there was one person in there with a gun, he would probably have found a different place. He didn’t think about a neighbor coming with a gun , and when he did he jumped in his car and tried to get away. These people who want to take away our guns are only making it easier for something like this to happen any where the shooter wants it to. Someone who is going to kill people like this man did do no care about gun laws or any other law. Laws only pertain to law abiding citizens. Nobody would have gotten out of that church alive if the neighbor did not have a gun and know how to use it.

    • Norman

      Jeanne Assam, the armed security guard at the New Life Church in Colorado Springs, stopped a shooter in 2007.

      Two pastors and their wives attended the same conceal weapon class I attended. One of those pastors told me he was attending the class because he occasionally gets threats – I assume from leftist, atheist, anti-gun demonicrats.

  • ipsd48

    The article misses another very important point; after receiving a DD the shooter spent nearly a year in a mental institution, from which he escaped. ANOTHER reason he should have been banned from having any guns.
    Looks like the AF wasn’t the only ones that dropped the ball.

  • Steven David Cessna

    we need to remain vigilent

  • mrpoohead

    ………and We Europe et al regulations and a homicide rate a fifth to a tenth of ours would indicate the opposite. We average a mass shooting a day, they’d be struggling to get to 365 in the lifetime of the gun. America – the toilet of the modern world.

    • Norman

      Who is this WE you keep typing about?

      • mrpoohead

        Well the one before “Europe” is a typo – duh! The others are what is known as the “royal we” – the country doofus!
        So America – a mass shooting per day. Plus a homicide rate five to ten times that of our peers and even most of the Middle East. Yuk! Emigrate – we did!

        • Norman

          Duh! You made the typo, doofus.

          • mrpoohead

            I’m happy to admit my mistakes – what about all of yours. You know not how the country works, don’t understand policies, history is drivel. Not really got a lot going for you.

          • Norman

            Aw, poophead, I’m happy to admit YOUR mistakes also.

          • mrpoohead

            One typo as opposed to pretty much everything you espouse. Wow! Is that supposed to belittle me – what are you 6 or 7?

          • Norman

            Wow! You guessed my age – I am 67.

          • mrpoohead

            ………and you don’t know how the country works, what you are voting for or pretty much anything else. Maybe it is time to start reading books and give up on the masturbation?

          • Norman

            The country? England?

            I know how the USA works. That’s why I VOTED AGAINST hilLIARy.

          • mrpoohead

            No you don’t as is very evident from your posts – folk who have no knowledge on how the system works really don’t deserve a vote, that a retards. suspect you’re both.
            Don’t really give a shit about Clinton – Trump/Clinton, pig or a cow, both repugnant. We got the pig – whoop!
            50% of the electorate had the right answer – didn’t bother!

          • mrpoohead

            Then you agree with everything I have said – thank you. I have only espoused facts and you haven’t refuted any of them with a reference so obviously you are in agreement despite your prior ignorance – thanks for the acknowledgement. Mr Poohey – always right!

          • Norman

            You have NOT espoused one fact YET. I have, however refuted ALL of your LIES.

          • mrpoohead

            Aaaaaah; the asylum is missing one of its fruitcakes. Or, please list one lie with reference. Good luck with that.

          • mrpoohead

            P.S. Actually don’t bother, you’ve agreed with me already – that’s fine.

  • My country

    “First off this site is one that monitors every comment made .If you are too much for your country they will mess with what you write and it won’t make sense .Or they will remove it .”
    Every one of us who live in Texas had better blast John Cronyn’s office with calls and letters .This dirtbag is working with a democratic senator from California and is trying to put a bill in that will take our guns . This SOB needs to be gone now not later . He is afraid that Antifa is going to find out he really is a privileged white guy . He went with the narrative that the white supremacists were the problem in Charlottesville Va .When I wrote him and called him on this .He sent me back a letter condemning only whites .Not putting blame on anybody else .The democratic mayor of that town was the one who called the DNC to set up that whole thing .All for the gun control people to be brainwashed with their acts of sedition and treason . And the media did their part of controlling the narratives . Just like they did with Waco and Vegas and Rubyridge ! They sent in the BLM and Antifa to kill and do bodily harm to people .,We must fight like hell to keep our guns or we will be another Germany or Sweden .If you rape one of my females in my family there’s no judge or jail that will keep me from killing you Even if I have to do it with my bare hands . The Sorry democratics who are all communists want every last free thinking American killed . Don’t think so ? Well look up who is passing laws and working for illegals against every legal American . And they are leading the charge with the Rino republicans to take our guns . Go look up what the Germans are trying to protect them selves with against The invasion of killers Merkel has put in the middle of the people ,